Nasal Discharge and Motion Sickness

[Flashy]

Eep, just read all you've been through overnight (well, overnight for me). Poor you and poor little bunny.

I too wonder how she is? and also how you are doing?

 

[Amy27]

She made it through the night. But still is refusing to eat. They want to hospitalize her tomorrow if I can't get her to eat today. She didn't have any diarrhea last night so they are not going to do the enema. I picked up sub q fluids and am going to do 100ml 2-3 times a day.

I will be upset if they hospitalize her. I don't know if I think that is the best. But they are an ER clinic so a vet would be on staff 24-7 so I guess that is a good thing.

Claire, I never thought of an inner ear infection. That would also explain why I just noticed how bad she was in the car the last few times I have taken her to the vet. I will ask the vet about it. How do they diagnosis ear infections? Can they tell just by looking in the ears?

Thank you all for being here for me. I really appreciate it.

 

[Flashy]

I'm so glad she is still fighting, but sad that things are so rough for you both.

An ear infection can not always be diagnosed by looking in the ear. I believe they need to culture it to identify if there is an infection there, but someone else will probably clarify on that.

If it is an ear infection that might also contribute to her not eating because she may be feeling disorientated with it.

 

[Amy27]

She is fighting and I am proud of how good she is being for me. Since I got home from work (I worked a half a day) I got 100 ml of sub q's in her, 10ml of critical care, 1 piece of hay and 1 bite of carrot. Plus she peed on me I will try to give her more sub q's and critical care this evening.

Flashy the vet took a culture of her nasal discharge and that showed Bordetella but I am wondering now if she has both. I am definatly going to bring this up to the vet.

 

[Maureen Las]

I guess that she could have more than 1 infection going on...I hope that she can get back on antibiotics soon.

We are used to the "baytril underdosing vets on here" and not used to the ones who actually try the correct drugs.....(even if they didn't work
the way we planned) Did your vet have heart surgery today? ;; if so who will cover???

 

[Amy27]

She did have heart surgery today. She told me after today she could be reached on the phone. There will be other vets in the office but they are not as rabbit savvy. This makes me really uncomfortable. I don't trust the other vets. I am not sure what I will do if things don't get better. I believe the vet will call in and get updates from her vet tech who called me several times today for an update. I think she returns on thursday or friday. She said 3-4 days.

 

[BethM]

Amy, I am just now seeing this. I am so sorry to hear that Little Bunny is not feeling well.

I don't have any medical advice, but I wanted you to know that I'm keeping you, Little Bunny, and Chase in my thoughts.

ray:

 

[Amy27]

Thank you Beth

Little Bunny is being more active tonight. When I opened her cage she came right out. I also caught her eat one piece of hay by herself.

 

[Maureen Las]

That is good news ..must have been the zithromax

 

[JadeIcing]

So sorry have not been around here. I will post a response to your questions when I get out of work. I am picking up 3 maybe 6 dogs tomorrow for the weekend so been getting ready.

 

[Amy27]

Thanks Ali, sounds like you are going to have a very busy weekend.

Little Bunny is still not eating. I am out of ideas and getting frustrated. I don't understand how she can still not be eating.

 

[Maureen Las]

Yeh that is strange you would think that she would have started by now. I'm sure that you are probably syringe feeding her....

Will she eat anything out of your hand?

 

[tonyshuman]

At least she is getting a lot of water. I would have thought that would get her gut going, but it is probably more than a GI slowdown that's making her not want to eat. I'm sure the buprenex is helping with pain, but it will also slow down the GI. Tooth pain could also be making her not want to eat.

The metronidazole confuses me. That's typically given for an overgrowth of clostridium, or sometimes as an antibiotic or for "worms". Maybe it's causing GI upset? Do you know why that was prescribed?

Ali, what do you give Ringo to make him feel less dizzy? Meclizine?

This is hard because the problems are overlapping and could be affecting each other. We know she has some spurs, we know she has bordatella in her upper respiratory tract. She's on at least one antibiotic that could cause gut slowdown, and pain meds that can do that too. She was given a gut stimulant, but it didn't do a lot of good. The antibiotics can also make her not want to eat, along with the spurs and the upset stomach. :?

 

[Amy27]

angieluv, I am giving her the critical care but according to the vet tech I am not giving enough. I gave her 23ml's yesterday and 28 ml's today. I syringe the critical care and Little Bunny just lets it sit in her mouth. I have tried rubbing her nose, neck and petting her to get her to swallow. Or she will just let it run out of her mouth.

Claire, the vet didn't explain the reason for giving the metronidazole real good. I know she mentioned it was an antibiotic to help her GI tract. But then when I got home I was thinking what good would an antibiotic do if there isn't an infection.

The buphrenex was only given on monday via an injection and now she is on metacam twice a day. They can give her more buphrenex but I declined because she was so out of it the day they gave it to her.

I want to talk to the vet about all the meds she is on because I do think that they could be making it worse. I called today and the vet won't be back until Friday.

I tried talking to the vet tech today but her and I clash a little bit. She just wants to push more meds via injection and I don't want to.

Her activity last night was really good. When I let her out she went to Chase's gate like she normally does and banged on that and left some microscopic little poops.

I am thinking of taking her in tomorrow and letting the vet tech give her some critical care since she feels she can get more into her and more sub q's as she would probably be able to get more of that into her. But going to the vet stresses her out pretty bad.

Angieluv, if I try to feed her by hand she gets really upset. She will bite the hay off so it is really short and drop it. I tried to get her to eat a piece of dandilion yesterday and she got so mad she shredded it by ripping it with her mouth and dropping it. Today for a few hours I took her condos out of her cage so she had to lay on the floor next to all her food. She then laid on the magazine so I took that out and put hay all around her and I saw her eat a few pieces.

 

[Maureen Las]

I was just looking up the metronidazole (Flagyl)in "When your rabbit needs Special care" by kathy smith/ Lucille Moore
it is givento prevent the growth of clostridium in the Gi tract if the rabbit is not eating and pooping . But it is to be used with caution.

I have my own personal opinion on forcing the "correct " amount of CC down a bun when they are not eating. I, like Randy, feel hydration is most important but to force feed a lot of food on an inappetent rabbit is stressful...
can you get pure canned pumpkin down her in a syringe; it is way easier to feed than CC.

I have never fed a bun the amount a vet told me to feed but used my own judgment in giving some but not so much thatI am really stressing out the rabbit.

This is just my own opinion and we really don't know what else is going on with her.

any other way that you can describe her ?

is she [pooping?

 

[tonyshuman]

If she's pooping, and acting normally, I wouldn't stress out about her not eating as much as normal. I know we always want our bunnies to be eating constantly, but with zithromax, it just doesn't seem to happen. I know Randy would mention that he had bunnies not eat for a few days and be fine if they were very ill. Did you try Nutri-Cal? As long as she's herself, is getting lots of water, and is pooing, I wouldn't syringe feed her a ton.

Re: metronidazole: I bet they thought she had clostridium due to the runny poo after not pooing. Stasis can cause clostridium to overgrow, which then leads to diarrhea. I'd stop giving it if her poos are firm.

 

[Amy27]

I will try to describe somethings better. Her poop is really really small. If it wasn't for the fact she left more then one poop in a spot, I wouldn't even notice it. I can't even think of anything that small to describe it except a piece of dirt or dust. She doesn't poop throughout the day. She only poops at night when I let her out and she goes in front of Chase's cage. I didn't see any normal sized poops from last night/today.

I still think she is holding her head funny at times, like I described her doing in the car where her head is up more towards the sky then normal. I tried to get a picture but when I go in her cage she sits up normal. This could be me just monitoring her more that I am noticing this.

She is laying around more then normal but still has a good activity level.

I have tried getting her and Chase all excited for a treat and she will get excited come to her cage and rub her chin on the treat. Then she will go to the side of her cage where Chase is to watch her eat the treat. It is like she wants it, but won't eat it. She has treats in her cage now that have been there for days.

She did munch on 2 dandilion leafs while I was sleeping last night. But didn't eat anything else.

That is all I can think of to describe her activity. Oh one more thing I noticed that is that she is licking and chewing on these wooden things I have hanging on her cage. She has had them for years and never has touched them. So I find it weird that she is now. If you have any specific questions, I would be happy to answer them.

I am not going to really stress her out to give her as much critical care as they want. I am trying to follow her signs. When I feel she can't handle anymore I stop. Today she started this new thing when I try to feed it to her where she climbs up on my lap and will try to hide her face in my stomach or jump up on my chest and will put her head in my neck/hair area. To me, that shows me I am stressing her out.

I stated above that I put hay around her. Well she moved some of it so I put a big piece from the bale of hay I have there. I have seen her picking at it, eating a few pieces here and there.

I just can't wait for the vet to be back. I want x-rays done. What if it is something internal and we just contributed it to the antibiotic. I want more tests done and I want the medications she is on to be re-examined. I have never dealt with GI stasis so I don't know if this is normal time frame or not for a bunny to still not be eating normally.

Right now she is cleaning her ears. She can't feel to bad to be up moving around and cleaning her ears I would think. I just don't understand if she feels ok why she isn't hungry.

This is so confusing to me and I keep second guessing myself and the vet. The vet doesn't think Benebac is effective or nutrical. I have thought of just giving them anyways, it wouldn't hurt anything.

ETA: I did want to say that Little Bunny has always had smaller poops with some normal sized ones. She has always been a picky eater, never been big on eating during the day.

 

[Maureen Las]

I think that she has something going on with an ear infection or something because of the one statement that you made about her holding her head up...
that struck me more than anything else......

I would give her benebac as it won't hurt her at all and maybe it won't help but it won't hurt.

it sounds as if you have a good handle on feeding her correctly

Ialso wish that your vet was back...

if her poops are small I would continue the metronidazole

The one thing I will say is that I don't think that she has not been completely diagnosed , like Claire said earlier there is more than one issue going on..........

 

[JadeIcing]

tonyshuman wrote:

Ali, what do you give Ringo to make him feel less dizzy? Meclizine?

Yes well Bonine. Which I buy with the car sick dremamine non drowsy. Pharmacist pointed out it is the same thing.

 

[JadeIcing]

Honestly it was what you described. Thats why I was thinking the same thing. It is why vet visits only if I can't treat what is bothering him. Even when he is doing well like he is now a car ride throws him for a huge loop.

Amy27 wrote:

JadeIcing wrote:

Flashy wrote:

The only time I've had a rabbit get disorientated in the car was Tilly, who has head tilt. She doesn't struggle like Little Bunny did but she is very clearly disorientated. Might just be worth watching to see if anything develops that could be related to disorientation in a rabbit, although the zithromax should help fight against anything potentially there.

I was thinking the exact same thing. Both Ringo and Gabriel do horribly during car rides.

Ali, Do you mind telling me what yours do or how they act? I guess I am comparing Little Bunny to Chase because they are the only two I have/had. Maybe Chase just does good during car rides and Little Bunny is normal.

I also think the Bordetella may be contributing to the rough car rides,as the last two car rides have been way worse. I mentioned that to the vet. But I think she was concerned because so much stuff came out of her nose during the car ride. Which is why the vet said she thought what was coming out of her nose was acid from her stomach and then gave her the Reglan.