Ec bunny bladder issues

[nuttymeg]

My little man cocoa puff has had Ec twice and seems to be going through a third bout of it. He was taken to an emergency clinic july2 at 1am due to squeaking in pain 3 times,small very small poops and a slightly elevated fever of 39.9 The vet suggested that EC could have caused the stasis as he has paresis of his back legs,he cannot stand,hop etc but he can move and has sensation in them both. she put him on 3 different motility drugs,metacam and panacur.
I have been expressing his bladder for over a year for him as he doesnt pee a drop on his own. But since the stasis its become near impossible to get anything out of him and when i do its not much and very dark,almost looks black. My regular vet is looking into drugs that may help his bladder to contract. But im wondering if anyone has experienced anything like this?

 

[JBun]

I've had a bun with hind limb paresis, but she was able to maintain bladder control until she passed from old age.

Black urine doesn't sound good. Does the vet think it's from blood in the urine or is your bun dehydrated? Has your vet done xrays or an ultrasound, to see if there might be something more going on in there? Or a urinalysis to determine why the urine is so dark?

I wonder if the vet could put a catheter in, to help the urine drain. Of course this would only work if your bun could be prevented from chewing at it.

 

[nuttymeg]

He saw his vet today,she went to manually express his bladder and she had a hard time getting it because she said it felt very flacid,which both myself and my husband noticed before. So she put in a catheter,she said when inserting it,it stopped as if there was a blockage or blood clot and she pushed it in harder and it went through after that. His urine as she put it looked very angry. So we both suspect a really nasty infection. So shes sent off his urine to be checked but she feels with all the meds hes on it may not show anything.
She also put saline solution in his bladder and flushed it out then put some pain relief in his bladder,i think it was pain relief?

 

[nuttymeg]

so he is still having issues. An xray is scheduled tomorrow to check for stones. What is going on with him is this,
His bladder is very flacid,he ends up looking bloated because we cant completely empty his baldder. When he last had the flush his urine streams were very good,but after a few days they became very thin.
He has ec,has paresis from said ec. I have been manually expressing his bladder for over a year now. He cannot pee on his own at all,he doesnt leak urine either.
Hes had a slight fever since 2 weeks ago,prior he was around 98.4 hes currently 99.4 or around there as it fluctuates a bit either lower or higher. Vet feels he isnt a good candidate for surgery if it ends up being stones. She would prefer to catheter when needed.
He did have his urine tested but i havent heard anything back about it and that was 2 weeks ago.

He is 5 years old,turning 6 next month,english angora. Can stones cause a flacid tone to the bladder? when we get him to pee we can get a few good streams then just a trickle and he will still be very full. He is on baytril injectible and chloramphenicol.

 

[JBun]

Stones shouldn't affect the bladders actual ability to function, they just create blockage issues, possible tissue damage, and pain as far as I know. The bladder not contracting and emptying would be a problem with the bladder itself, and the nerves associated. Though thick sludge and stones could block the bladder, preventing urine coming out. Is your bun also on meloxicam? I'm just wondering if maybe there is some inflammation, and that's contributing to the urine stream stopping.

If you don't find any other solutions or answers to this health issue, I don't even know if this is possible for rabbits, but when people have problems where the bladder doesn't work, they get a tube surgically inserted to bypass the bladder, with a urostomy bag so the bladder can empty. This could only work if your bun could somehow be prevented from chewing at the tube and the bag(like with a cone if needed, though possibly a bunny post surgical shirt might be enough). Like I said, I have no idea if this is even possible in rabbits as I can't really find any literature on it, but it might be worth asking your vet if such a thing even exists for rabbits. If there are really no other viable options to help your rabbit, maybe this would be worth a try.

 

[nuttymeg]

We thought of it being nerve issues but when he had the catheter last time he actually pushed it out twice. He is on pain meds i forgot to mention that. Hes been through the wringer my boy,tons of stasis through the years,flystrike twice which i caught before any damage was done thankfully,that and hes strictly an indoor bunny,which shocked me he got it twice. Hes had 2/3 bouts of ec and back in october had a severe pressure sore that took almost 2 months to heal and now this bladder issue. My vet feels he isnt a good candidate for any surgery. So she wants to stick with catherization when absolutely needed. She will be teaching this to me tomorrow.

We can sometimes get a really good urine stream then it just becomes so thin you barely see anything coming out. We got 7 streams out last night which i was thrilled about,by the 7th it was almost impossible to see it coming out,so i strongly feel there is a blockage bouncing around in there. I am not about to give up on him,that is not in me at all. ive done so much over the years for him,worst thing was picking maggots out from his scent glands twice.

I do wonder if its ec again for him causing this possibly,when he had the stasis the emerg vet said it was a big possibility. I am very dedicated to helping him dont worry about that.

 

[nuttymeg]

so after nagging my vet for 2.5 weeks for my rabbits urine work up i finally get a copy. Shes not being very upfront about the findings can anyone here help me out,seems he has a staph infection?

 

[JBun]

Interpreting the results is what your vet is supposed to be there for. That's one of the things you paid them for. So maybe keep after your vet on the findings of the lab result. How long has your rabbit been on the baytril and chloramphenicol?

High ketones can happen with anorexia and diabetes. High protein and dark urine can happen with dehydration. High protein can also happen with kidney damage. Brownish urine happens with a UTI. I don't really know anything beyond that.

https://dontdumprabbits.org/resources/interpreting-lab-test-results-on-rabbits/
If your vet isn't being very helpful, it might be worth getting a consultation, or a second opinion on the lab report from a different rabbit vet.

 

[nuttymeg]

he has been on the baytril for 2 weeks and the chloramphenicol for almost 2 weeks now. My vet has talked to others and its been suggested hes to be put on sulfa trimethoprim. Hopefully this will turn him around. Hes had a very low fever it bounces around a bit.

 

[nuttymeg]

Jbun I thought i would update.

So he had blood work done yesterday as there were concerns he may have had kidney damage. We wanted to check before starting the sufa drug.And hes actually doing pretty good,still fighting an infection. I have never been so nervous like i was yesterday. Finding out hes doing ok is the best news of my life.

 

[JBun]

Trying sulfa abx was my next thought. That's great the blood work looked good Hopefully with the change(or addition) of starting this new antibiotic, that it really starts to improve things for your bun, and he can get back to feeling more normal again. Please do keep posting updates. I'm very interested in how he's doing and what actually helps cause improvements for him.

 

[nuttymeg]

Trying sulfa abx was my next thought. That's great the blood work looked good Hopefully with the change(or addition) of starting this new antibiotic, that it really starts to improve things for your bun, and he can get back to feeling more normal again. Please do keep posting updates. I'm very interested in how he's doing and what actually helps cause improvements for him.

everything that this little man has gone through over the years it really is hard to fathom. But hes a survivor 1000%
when she wanted blood work yesterday i was so worried that my fears would be reality. I kept convincing myself he was fine,and thankfully he is. This little man has had stasis numerous times,he actually had liquid poop years ago that flew out of him,he has had EC twice,possibly 3 times,flystrike twice,which got caught very early and back in october last year he had a very nasty bed sore that took almost 2 months to heal up. So i know he will get through this.

 

[JBun]

That's incredible he's experienced all of that and survived! He's quite the fighter! He's so lucky to have such a caring and attentive owner/carer

 

[nuttymeg]

That's incredible he's experienced all of that and survived! He's quite the fighter! He's so lucky to have such a caring and attentive owner/carer

there isnt anything i wouldnt do for him. When he had the bedsore,i thought i was doing the right thing by keeping him on a padded surface. I bought mats that were fabric on the top. Apparently they were too abrasive. So hes on quadrupled balnkets,while he was healing he was on memory foam. I had to cut the dead tissue off,saline rinse it every day,rebandage it everyday-i used hydrocolloid bandages,and those worked amazing for it. I just need to get his weight back up as he is very thin and bony at the moment.
Here are some *graphic* photos of that bed sore. Different stages of healing.

 

[JBun]

Poor little guy. That is pretty nasty to look at That's nice to know about those bandages(might have to get some just to have on hand ).

I had an older disabled bun due to spondylosis. She lost use of her hind limbs the last year of her life(lived to be 10yrs). In the beginning she could scoot herself around with her front legs, then the last 4 months she could only scoot in a 2 ft circle.

She managed to keep herself pretty clean, despite the disability. I never had to bathe her. She could still pee herself, but just couldn't use her hind legs much, so she was on a pile fleece fabric to help keep the urine drained away from her, with a cotton towel and puppy pee pad underneath to absorb the urine. Then the flooring was eva foam tiles. It all seemed to work, as she never developed skin problems.

But it's hard to know what flooring to use for them, as what you think would be soft and good on their skin, sometimes causes problems. I'm just lucky that it worked out, as I wasn't sure what would work to keep her dry and be soft enough. She still seemed to be doing pretty well despite all of her old age health issues. She sitll loved snuggling wih her bun friend, and scooting over for treats. So it was just a matter of trying to keep all the complications from the health issues managed, to maintain her quality of life as long as possible. Which I was able to do until she passed from old age.

 

[nuttymeg]

Poor little guy. That is pretty nasty to look at That's nice to know about those bandages(might have to get some just to have on hand ).

I had an older disabled bun due to spondylosis. She lost use of her hind limbs the last year of her life(lived to be 10yrs). In the beginning she could scoot herself around with her front legs, then the last 4 months she could only scoot in a 2 ft circle.

She managed to keep herself pretty clean, despite the disability. I never had to bathe her. She could still pee herself, but just couldn't use her hind legs much, so she was on a pile fleece fabric to help keep the urine drained away from her, with a cotton towel and puppy pee pad underneath to absorb the urine. Then the flooring was eva foam tiles. It all seemed to work, as she never developed skin problems.

But it's hard to know what flooring to use for them, as what you think would be soft and good on their skin, sometimes causes problems. I'm just lucky that it worked out, as I wasn't sure what would work to keep her dry and be soft enough. She still seemed to be doing pretty well despite all of her old age health issues. She sitll loved snuggling wih her bun friend, and scooting over for treats. So it was just a matter of trying to keep all the complications from the health issues managed, to maintain her quality of life as long as possible. Which I was able to do until she passed from old age.

My vet was told when he had the sore to put him down that it wouldnt heal etc,i refused and researched what i could do for him. And found hydrocolloid bandages were going to be my secret weapon. They autolytically debride the wound,he had copious amounts of creamy goop when i changed the bandages,that i had to wash away. My vet was so shocked he healed,i really did it all on my own,right down to removing the dead tissue.
My little man is an english angora and i thought the scab he had was from a knick from taking his coat off,I had no clue what lurked underneath until that scab came off,and i was in pure horror over it. But its in his past and a lesson learned.
I have 8 english angoras,2 disabled,the other one has her front legs splayed.
Just got a newbie a few weeks back that has EC,being treated for that currently,he was in rough shape when i took him,at 8 weeks old was 1.9 pounds,today he is 2.9 pounds! All my buns are indoor and in my livingroom.