Ms Cleo's got an upset tummy again

[Cyber-Wizard]

Hi All;

I'm not sure if I'm overreacting or if she's truly different this time. I posted back in 2009 and again in 2010 when Cleo had some stomach problems. Since then she's been incredibly healthy. She's only had a couple of occurrences of GI trouble in the last few years and thanks to the great advice here it was always cleared up with plenty of water and some tummy rubs. This time it feels different.

She's 7 years old now and enjoys plenty of Oxbow and Zupreem Timothy hay. I give her about 1/8th of a cup of Martin's Adult pellets a day and she eats about 1-1/2 cups of green veggies twice a day. All veggies are cut up in advance and kept soaking in water for at least 8 hours before she gets them.

On Saturday morning I woke up to find her hunkered down in her cage. I presumed it to be the same issue she'd had in the past as this happens about once a year. I started to give her water with a syringe and sat with her all day. She wouldn't take hay and only occasionally took water. By Saturday night she was laying with her head beside the water dish licking condensation off of the side. Since she wasn't drinking anyway I put a couple of ice cubes in the dish to keep the condensation on the side of the dish. I could easily get her to take water by that time by holding her water bottle out to her. She would drink plenty as long as she didn't have to get up and get it herself. I tried giving her a few small pieces of parsley without any luck. I left the parsley in her dish and on Sunday morning it was gone. I gave her another drink from her bottle and she started eating hay on her own. A few hours later we got our first signs of pooping since Friday night and she continued to drink and eat hay and a few greens. She still wasn't moving around much and just laid in her litter box. My wife stayed with her today and gave her water at hourly intervals. Cleo started grooming as well as eating hay on her own. Late in the afternoon she used the litterbox again and it contained several droppings all of which were very wet.

It's Sunday night now and she's continuing to eat hay, her stomach is gurgling and she'll drink water if it's given to her but she's still just laying in her litter box. After each drink of water she'll sit up, groom her ears, wash her face, and then just lay down again and resume lazily eating the hay that she's laying on. On occasion she'll leave the litter box and then I'll clean it out and put fresh litter and hay in it. She excitedly hops back in and starts eating hay whenever I clean out the box but after a few minutes she lays down with her head on the side of the box again. It feels to me like she was recovering just like she always does but then took a step backward. I'm not certain if something is truly different this time or if she's recovering just fine but is tired from all she's gone through and I'm overreacting.

 

[Zeroshero]

If her tummy is gurgling it is possible she has gas pains, do you have any simethicone on hand you could give her?

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

If her tummy is gurgling it is possible she has gas pains, do you have any simethicone on hand you could give her?

I've tried getting some Oval into her but you know how the smell of it tips them off. She's never tolerated being handled and getting anything into her against her will has always been next to impossible.

I set my alarm to wake up at 2:00am and I gave her some more water and a few tummy rubs. Eventually she got annoyed and hopped out of the litter box. There was no sign of anything in the litter box other than a fresh pee spot. I rubbed her nose until she flopped on her side and then continued the tummy rubs. When the Simethicone came out she zipped back over to the litter box with her back to me.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

I got up again at 5:30 to give her some more water. She didn't appear to have moved from the spot she was laying in 2 hours earlier. She did take a drink of water when offered but leapt away when the Ovol came out. If nothing else, that stuff gets her moving if not necessarily her gut. When she hopped out of the litter box I found two normal sized but misshapen pellets under her. I changed out her litter box and she got back in it, laid down again, and started eating the fresh hay. She's eating hay steadily and drinking water whenever offered, but she won't get up unless something makes her.

I read through my posts from the last two times she had issues and this doesn't seem much different really. The big difference last time was that I took her to the vet, and she was out of the cage and moving around somewhat. This time she doesn't seem to have any interest in getting out of the cage, or even the litterbox what so ever.

 

[Azerane]

I would get her to the vet, at the very least they could give her a gut stimulant. It seems that it may have already been a couple of days since she pooped normally, is that right? If so I wouldn't wait any longer unless you're absolutely sure you can get simethicone into her. Bandit hated being force fed it, but it simply had to be done. You either force it in with a syringe, or go to the vet I think.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

I did manage to get some Ovol into her. Man is she angry now! I took the roof off of her cage to get the Ovol into her and she took off running after i did it. She hunted around for a good place to hide and wound up sulking in the kitchen. I would have preferred her in the living room rather than on the cold ceramic tile but at least she's moving around a little. I may give her a while to settle down and then go visit again. She won't even look at me now and runs when I come near. If I walk out there that should send her back to the living room carpeting.

 

[Zeroshero]

Luckily my bun thinks everything that comes in a syringe is food, he has GI issues also which are improved significantly by exercise and tummy rubs too. Hopefully her tummy gets sorted soon, it is terrible fretting over these guys.

Will she drink plain pedialyte? Hydration is also extremely important for their gut function. I keep powdered small animal electrolyte (hydropet) on hand, Zero loves it and it seems to help things get moving.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

I've got her back in the living room now but she doesn't want to lay on the carpet, she'll pick a tile or linoleum spot and lay there instead. In the cage she had cleared all of the bedding away and was laying directly on the floor. She always seems to prefer that. At least there's a lot of sunlight in the living room so she'll likely migrate to a warm spot.

I've tried Pedialyte once or twice in the past. She won't have anything to do with it. After I went through my first GI scare, I started putting a little apple juice in her water to encourage drinking. That worked well once she was feeling fine again but I discovered that, when she's not feeling well, she will only drink plain water. Ultimately she took to drinking again and has stayed with clear water since then. She won't drink from her dish at the moment but has been happy to drink from her bottle if someone holds it for her. She'll also drink any water that spills to the floor from the bottle.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

I took Cleo to the vet today. She suffers from intestinal problems every year at this time. As I've mentioned, this year she doesn't seem to be getting any better like she usually does.
The vet described it as a "perfect storm". They're still doing diagnosis but so far the following all hit her at once.
Her maloccluded teeth were giving her problems earlier than last year and possibly irritated her eyes.
I guess she has allergies and that's why we see a G.I. issue every year at about the same time.
Her eyes had dried out as her tear ducts were plugged, her sinuses filled up and she likely had a migraine.
It looks like she has arthritis and the pain in her hips has caused her to not pee correctly which is preventing her from fully purging calcium sediment from her bladder.
The pain of her distended bladder and cecum is what was causing her to stop eating and therefore stop pooping.
On the way to the vet she finally emptied her bladder and left sludge all over the carrier. We had to pour her out of the carrier as she was about ready to give up and was showing all the signs of being ready to die. The tech walked in and said "We're taking her in the back to give her pain medication" after only a few seconds looking at her. By the time we left they had her pretty doped up and had already checked her eyes with fluorescene and determined that she had a fever. She was very relaxed but hardly knew that we were there when we said goodbye.
They expect to keep her for the next three days or so. The battery of tests they're running seem pretty intensive. I signed a DNR order in case she crashes during any of the procedures. I just don't want her to suffer. They're optimistic that she'll recover and be home soon. I'm hoping they're right but couldn't say so. The Mrs. had to do all the talking as I was busy crying.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

We stopped in to visit Cleo last night after work. It was pretty hard to see her in that tiny little cage with an IV in her paw. She is on the mend but isn't quite there yet. She's eating her hay like it's something that she'll never see again. The staff at the hospital have developed a whole series of procedures in how to deal with Cleo. They're referring to her as "The Queen". She has decided that the cage that they have her in belongs to her and no one is permitted access without proper obeisance. There are some staff who give her hay and food, while others give her medication. Those who bring hay and treats can open the cage and present her with hay and then she'll grant them access. Those who bring medication have to first present their hands for sniffing before opening the door and rubbing her nose. She will still fight them like a holy terror if the medication isn't to her liking but if they don't follow the correct procedure for approaching the cage she'll violently punch them. They've been changing her medication over to ones that taste like honey or other sweets to gain her acceptance. She's been tearing apart every litter box they give her, thumping, and spraying urine at them to get them all to behave the way she wants. Obviously she's well on the way to feeling better but she's being an absolute terror at the moment. Strangely she appears to have decided that because the cage is hers she can become completely comfortable when no one is bothering her. The vet technician had numerous photos and video of her flopped out on her side, sounds asleep and running in her sleep while in the midst of the treatment area with staff making noise and dogs barking. The staff there said that they've never had a rabbit that is staying with them flop and sleep so easily before.

They're going to run blood tests and run another set of x-rays to determine where her intestinal blockage might be. They're hoping that she might be able to have the IV removed today.

 

[Azerane]

It certainly sounds like she's a fighter! Hopefully she'll continue to recover well

 

[tonyshuman]

The "rabbitude" is a good sign. She wouldn't be fighting if she didn't have energy or had given up. It sounds like she's in good hands and they will do all they can for her. I'm hoping for the best. I know how hard it can be to leave your bun at the vet when they're in such dire straights but keep thinking good thoughts.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

This particular animal hospital has been disappointing in the past. They have a new vet for exotics who is really good at customer relations. She's very communicative and they've been calling me at least twice a day with updates.

She called today to let me know that Cleo has been meerkatting a lot throughout the day and has been intensely curious about everything going on outside her cage. The vet tech has shown us pictures and videos of Cleo flopped on her side snoozing in her cage which is located directly on top of a dog who seems to bark quite a lot. They said they've never seen a rabbit so comfortable in one of their cages before.

The x-rays came back and showed that her stomach and gut is moving along nicely. They also discovered that the sinus problem had caused her lungs to fill up. It looks like her fever was caused by a touch of pneumonia and not a bacterial infection like they thought. That's way better. Right now they're trying different meds to find ones that taste good enough for her to take them as treats. So far so good, she's actually excited about all of the meds except the antibiotics so they're still working on that. I miss her something awful. I've never had her away from the house for more than one night before. The house feels empty without the background noise that a bunny makes.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

Cleo is finally home!:yahoo:

Right after she came home she immediately ran to her cage and stretched out beside the hay, munching away. I gave her an hour or so to settle in and then went to visit her at the door of her cage. She was thrilled to have me petting her and went crazy licking my hand. She doesn't seem too inclined to come out and play just yet but she really wants to return to our old patterns. First thing this morning she was up on her top shelf waiting for her salad. The vet said it's OK for her to have greens but I'm still giving only a few at a time so she's sulking a little bit.

The big issue is getting the rest of her meds into her. She was sent home with 6 meds that she needs every 12 hours. Cleo has never cared for being handled. I can pet her all day long but she bolts as soon as I attempt to pick her up. The vet showed me how easy she had become to pick up and medicate while in the hospital. She simply laid her on a towel, wrapped her up, and gave her a syringe. She obviously didn't care for it but she didn't fight. At home it's a completely different story. As soon as I try to transition from petting to handling she bolts. If she sees a towel, she's very careful not to lay on it and she usually loves to lay on towels. We've run into this every time she's needed medication and most of the time she doesn't get all of it because of how much she stresses out with us trying to get it into her.

 

[tonyshuman]

Aww. Sounds like she's glad to be home. Too bad she's so upset about the meds. I give meds to my buns by kneeling over them, with the bunny between my knees. I apply gentle pressure on their sides to keep them in place, then I have my hands free to do whatever. I have been doing eye drops lately, so I need one hand for the dropper and the other to move the eyelid.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

We knelt down in front of her today and after a couple of attempts she absolutely panicked and leaped over a nearby briefcase being used to corral her proceeding to pee everywhere. We had to give up and let her go back to her cage to relax. We may have to look into boarding her just to let the vet finish off her course of meds. We're not so good at this.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

Thanks for the tip!! We tried that tonight and it was our smoothest and most successful attempt yet.

Aww. Sounds like she's glad to be home. Too bad she's so upset about the meds. I give meds to my buns by kneeling over them, with the bunny between my knees. I apply gentle pressure on their sides to keep them in place, then I have my hands free to do whatever. I have been doing eye drops lately, so I need one hand for the dropper and the other to move the eyelid.

 

[Cyber-Wizard]

Cleo is back on her feet again. We've just finished her two week round of meds and she's feistier than ever. We got our first binky a couple of nights ago and she's happily tearing the house up. She's eating and pooping better than ever before and is much happier now that we're not trying to get meds into her. Each time we found a method that worked, she would only let us get away with it 2 or 3 times before we had to try something else.

Now that she feels she's better she's demolishing her greens disturbingly fast and cleaning up what pellets she gets. Once she finishes those off she's equally happy to work through her hay until her evening meal.

Her allergies are still plaguing her pretty well. I bought a HEPA filter for the room that her cage is in and that significantly improved her symptoms. After turning the filter on the first night her eyes were completely clear and dry the next morning. The Mrs turned the filter off last night for some reason :craziness and Cleo's eyes were a blurry mess this morning. Her whole face was wet from her eyes weeping and all she wanted was to bury her head in my hands. The house is closed up with the filter and A/C running today (it's REALLY hot outside) so I'm hoping that her eyes clear up by the time that I get home. The vet felt that it was the allergies that pushed her over the edge when this started and I'd like to avoid a repeat performance.

The blood tests show that she might still be a little bit adrenal. The vet wants to run another blood test in a week or so to see if there's any change.