Leaving bunny running around the yard all day

[Aina]

Ok, so Ronnie gets to be out of his cage forlike two hours a day in the morning and then again in the evening mostof the time, though sometimes he is out at a diferent time of theday. My dad isn't comfortable with him being left in his cageall day so he wants to let him have run of the yard all thetime. Our yard is now succure and no dog can get back there.The fence is a privatcy fence and is really high.

I'm wondering if it would be ok for him to be out in our yardall the time except for at night. Now Maggie isn'ta problem. They were even laying next to eachother the otherday, but Ronnie doesn't want you to know that.

I'm pretty sure the only bird of prey we have in our area is the barredowl, we may have a red tailed hawk as they are supposedly inour area, but I have never seen or heard one.
The barred owl is too small to take off with Ronnie and hewould be in his cage at night anyways. He would also haveacces to his cage for food, water, and shelter.

 

[Pet_Bunny]

Whenever Pebbles is outside, I am outthere with her too. So depending how long I stayout, that is the amount Pebblesgets.I would be too scared to leavePebbles out on her own. If you can't keepan eye on them, anything can happen. Doyou know rabbits can dig a hole under the fence and get out of the yard.

Rainbows!

 

[luvthempigs]

I think it's much safer for your rabbit to stay in her cage while you are away.

There are a million things that could happen to her if left unsupervised and none of them are good ; )

Now if you can figure out a way to leave her in a room of your housethat has been rabbit proofed that would be a much better and saferchoice

 

[~Tracey~]

I could not leave my rabbit out with me not being there to keep an eye on things

 

[Pipp]

Not all that relevant, but here's what it tookto 'predator proof' an outdoor sanctuary. This isanemail I got back from Quan Myer, who hasa'Rabbitat for Humanity' outdoor sanctuary in an empty lot inMaine housing 87 rabbits.


Hi.
Be glad to let you know how I have built a predator
proof space for my bunnies. First I cover the ground
with welded, galvanized wire( no rusting out) so they
can not dig out and no animals can dig in. then I use
4 foot stockade fences and fill all holes with crushed
rock. The entire stockade has wire stapled to the
posts, (no way for predators to get in). I put two
strands of electric fences 4 and 8 to 10 inches around
the entire rabbitat. I put sensor lights in the trees
on all four corners of the rabbitat. It is time
consuming and expensive but well worth it. I have had
bunnies outside for 7 years and not lost any to
predators. I am hypervigilant, checking fences every
day, keeping the grass mown around it, and always
alert to any unfamiliar sound outside my bedroom
window at night. I am a light sleeper so if the fence
goes off or the lights come on, I am right out there.
I am very conscious about the possiblity of danger to
my bunnies, heat, cold, rain, etc. They are divided in
to small groups with hutches, tunnels, all kinds of
places to hide and be protected from the weather. They
live amongst a group of trees and have plenty places
to dig and eat grasses. I would be glad to send photos
to anyone interested. Quan

 

[luvthempigs]

Doesn't sound like something that many of would be able to do......

 

[Pipp]

Quan's bunnies live outside year round, and theyare rescues who would otherwise have died (or reproduced and died)without intervention, so I think what she's done is tremendous, I likebeing able to share.

I always get flack for saying this but sometimes I find the HRS mindseta little over-protective. It's like parentswithkids being advised to keep them indoorsat all times exceptwhen accompanied by a parent, which absolutely is the safest way togo. You look at the kid snatched while walking alone theshort distance home from the bus, but then you hear the stories of kidssnatched from their beds.

You can keep your loved ones, bunnies in this case, caged at all timesto keep them safe, and they'll live long but not well. Yougive them a roomie cage with multi-levels to compensate, they take abad hop andfracture their backs.Or youkeep them intiny cage, they're bored and chew off a tieandget a blockage. Or they try and squeeze throughthe NIC panels and strangle themselves. Or a storm hits, atree falls outside, they panic, can't run to escape theirfearand have a heart attack. There's just no end ofdangers in the world, sometimes you have to balance out living withexisting.

If a safe enclosure (tunnel proof) with LOTS of covered hidey spots,toys, sand, dirt or hay boxesto keep him occupied, safevegetation, etc, can be put together for a bunny the size of Ronnie(who is very large and not easy prey), I think it would work.A LOT of research has to be done into any potential predators,weather/shelter concerns, vegetation, and even theft possibilities, butI don't know that in his case constant supervision is the only option.

Just my opinion.

sas :?

 

[ec]

OTOH, there really are a lot of predatoryanimals and birds out there, and it only takes a couple of seconds forthings to get out of control.

Personally, though I'd like to be able to take my bunny outside forsome playtime, it just isn't feasible. There are too many dogs - alsohawks and other wild predators - where I live, at the edge of a largewooded area in the country. If it weren't for the neighborhood dogs, Ithink I'd risk it (under very close supervision), but ... A bite in theneck and she's gone.

We do see a lot of birds of prey here.

 

[Aina]

Thanks for your imput everyone

Ronnie is 11 lbs so he is not easy prey to birds.We have alot squirrels around that are a lot easier to get.I never leave Skye out by herself, nor will I, because she is toosmall.

The yard is fenced in well and I don't know of very many dogs that canscale a 8 foot wall without something against it tohelp. It is wood, not chain link, so it is dificultto climb.We don't have any stray dogs around here anyways.Our animal control is really good.

I live in the city so there arn't really any animals exceptfor squirrels and birds. We have cats, but they are smaller than Ronnieand they don't go in our yard much. Large rabbits don'treally have much to fear from cats anyways.

I do a daily walk around the fence for hole anyways because my dearestpuppy loves to escape, and I have a tortoise who has run of part of theyard and she can dig very well. The fence is deep enoughwhere it would take a bit to dig deep enough and by then he would becaught.
He is inside the house during bad weather.
I am also home all day because I am homeschooled, and he would be in his cage if I were gone.

 

[bluebird]

No,unless your fence has a top,Hawks areeverywere,coyotes,cats,our cats can climb most any fence and they willkill rabbits bigger than they are.rabbits are expert diggers aseveryone mentioned.bluebird

 

[ec]

There arre a lot of predatory animals incities - it's surprising, really. Hawks, coyotes (in some places),feral/abandoned dogs and cats, raccoons, etc.

I've read accounts by rabbit rescuers who live in major East and WestCoast cities, and they're not always pleasant reading. This is one ofthe reasons.

 

[jcottonl02]

I don't even leave my rabbit in the run when igo out. Rabbits can dig VERY well- i never thought so, cos Benji neverdid it until i took him over a friends house, put him in a run near afemale in season and he dug so deep in about 10 seconds i had to grabhim and put him somewhere else.
If you will be there to watch ur rabbit, then thats okay, but i wouldntreccomend it. You might as well just get a very big run and put her/himin that, rather than just let them run the garden.
Any predator, even if u dont know of them, could get your rabbit. I'venever seen a fox around our garden or anything, but as soon as I gotBenji, a few nights later he thumped like crazy and I went downstairs,turned on the lights, and the biggest fox iv ever seen was standingright outside his cage.
I've known too many of my friends losing rabbits (who run round the garden) being got by hawks too. About three I think.
Jenny

 

[ec]

there are nice plans (and photos of) an outdoorrun in Marinell Harriman's House Rabbit Handbook. She built thisso her rabbits could play outside in good weather (supervised anddaytime only, because lots more predators come at night). She has somegreat ideas for rabbit-proof construction + stuff to put in therun/play area. Needless to say, the whole structure is aspredator-proof as she can possibly make it, but she's very clear on thefact that keeping a close eye out is important.

It's definitely well worth checking out.

 

[Bassetluv]

I live in the city as well, and my backyard isbunnyproofed...rabbits can't get out, dogs can't get in. However, Iwould never leave my rabbits unattended out there for more than a fewmoments. There are cats in the neighborhood, some feral, some pets, andmost will not go anywhere near my yard because of my dog. She's prettygreat at keeping out anything that shouldn't be there. BUT...I cannotsolely rely on her for protection for my rabbits. Last summer a catwandered into the next-door neighbor's yard and spotted my rabbits. Iwas in the kitchen getting something, the rabbits and the dog were inthe backyard. Suddenly my dog began barking her fool head off, runningback and forth - into the house and out again - obviously trying to getme to follow her. When I did, I saw the cat on the other side of myfence. He was the biggest, most vicious feline I've ever runacross...his ears were flat back on his head, he was hissing andspitting and lunging at the wire because he wanted at the rabbits, whohe'd spotted.

If I hadn't been there and the rabbits had been runninglooseunsupervised for the day - or even an hour-I'm not sure what would have happened. My dog might havebeen successful at keeping the cat out...but then again, she might nothave. She seemed pretty afraid of it herself, and she's normally notafraid of other animals. Had the cat gained access to the yard, hecould have potentially killed one, or both, rabbits. And while Anna andRaph aren't huge, they also aren't all that small.

Two years ago I also discovered that I had a raccoon living in my shed.How long he'd been there, I don't know. But raccoons are knownpredators of rabbits, and they canreach into very smallspaces. Their paws are more like a human's hands, highly dextrous(sp?), and when raccoons are around precautions need to be tight. Notonly would one have to take into account the types of predators thatcould enter an enclosed yard, but there is also the factor oftransmittable diseases and/or severe injury from an attack.

Rabbits are animals of prey, and their main line of defense is to run.Cornered, they will scream and fight, but against an animal with clawsand teeth (or beak and talons) the odds are stacked against them. Throwinto that the fact that rabbits can die rather easily if frightenedbadly enough...well, it's a recipe for disaster to leave themunattended...unless they are in a secure, entirely predator-proof place.

imo...it's not worth it...

 

[monklover]

Even though you have neverseen hawks they are still there. Hawks have great sight andhave sharp talons to kill prey. I would suggest just leavingyour bun outside if you are around. I let my rabbit outside when I amhome and I have windows so that I can watch him. But if I can't see mybun from the window I have to keep checking on him every 5-10minutes.

 

[cmh9023]

I have to agree. I would be really afraid torisk it. What about adding some space by connecting a exercise fence toit and covering it?

 

[Pipp]

Checking every few minutes won't save a rabbitfrom a raptor, I know of many instances where people sitting in theiryards (or balconies) with their bunnies have hadhawkstakethem right in front of them. Ithappens in a wink.

I won't let my guys on my porch unless I'm standing there with them,and my porch iscovered.Butthere is aspacea hawkcan fly into betweentheceiling and floor, and until Icanhangplants and netting making sure a flying predator can't get the wingspanrequired, my bunnies aresupervised.

However, I think if the right research is done and the properprecautions taken,A LARGE BUNNY LIKE RONNIE canhavetherun ofan area with just limitedsupervision. Raptorscanonlycarry prey that I think is about 1/4 their own weight, I don't thinkthere are a lot of 40 lb hawks out there.

More of a concern are coyotes, dogs, cats, burrowing predators likeweasles, etc.. You have to research what is found in yourarea, not just what you've seen. (You don't see a lot ofpredators until you provide the prey, and then they're drawn to yourarea).

Now that it's spring, you have to research and watch for poisonousplants. And of course there's thechance of Ronnieburrowing out , but that takes time, so limited supervision will beneeded for that.

Yes, there's a chance a cat mayattack and injure him (not kill him), but there are hazards in the house, too.



sas

 

[Maureen Las]

cutereba flies, fly strike, predators, heatstroke, poisonous plants, fleas

 

[ec]

Not to belabor a point, but there are plenty oflarger raptors in my area (vultures, even eagles) - which definitelycan attack and kill larger prey animals. I'd be willing to bet thatyou've got some around Vancouver, too, given the location + largewooded parks in the city...

I guess what I'm trying to say is that, though I agree that we can'tcontrol everything in our environments, we can do a lot to makethings safer for animals - and small humans - without getting carriedaway over it. Which is one of the reasons I really like MarinellHarriman's ideas about large, covered runs/outdoor play area. (Dittofor other folks who've made similar structures and put a lot of thoughtand time into designing safe - but fun - places for buns to play.)

If I had the right kind of yard (including a good fence!) plusresources, I'd definitely build something like this - and I'd have afew more buns to go with it, too. (Maybe someday...)

 

[Pipp]

ec wrote:

Not tobelabor a point, but there are plenty of larger raptors in my area(vultures, even eagles) - which definitely can attack and kill largerprey animals. I'd be willing to bet that you've got some aroundVancouver, too, given the location + large wooded parks in the city...

Yup, one story had a hawk taking a bunny off the balcony of a hi-risenot far away. But certainly not a 10-lbrabbit. Otherwise fewdogs would be safe!

I'm right beside Stanley Park, one of the largest urban parks on thecontinent, I have skunks living under my house, squirrels in my ceilingand raccons in the tree in the yard. (Luvabun is a witness,she saw them about two feet away from me on the back porch off RadarandDarry's room. They're there every night on theirwayup to my roof,but they've never paid a wit ofattention to the bunnies, though, or vice-versa, go figure).

Our problem is coyotes, they're brazen b***ers who will snatch a cat ordog right off a leash in well-travelled, very urbanarea.:shock:

ec wrote:

I guess what I'm trying tosay is that, though I agree that we can't control everything inour environments, we can do a lot to make things safer for animals -and small humans - without getting carried away over it. Which is oneof the reasons I really like Marinell Harriman's ideas about large,covered runs/outdoor play area. ...

Absolutely agreed there. I always mentionQuanMyers' operation because it's for a large number of bunnies in an emptylot, but for a small warren, those backyard set-ups reallyarethe right ticket.

I'd love to see Ronnie hang out in something likethat.He'salready out in the yard fourhours a day, he was actually found outside when he was firstadopted. In his particular case -- a rare case -- expandingit by a few mid-day hours isn't criminal.

But Aina really has todo more research and bewellaware of all the hazards mentioned in this thread, from flystrike tovegetation to predators. (Ithink cats anddogsin particular can still beaproblem, afence won't keep out the former and maybe not the latter withoutfortification). She needs to incorporate a lot of Harriman'sand Myers' safety ideas into the exisitng space.

sas