Is This Stasis?

[Jenk]

Emma's again having smaller-than-normal poops. (She did this in Oct., too.)

She's officially shedding now;we're brushing her really well at least once daily. She also has some normal-sized poops, a few strung with hair, and all of the poops in her box are still moist (vs. dried out).

I'm confused as to why she so frequently has poops start to get smaller. Is it just the Mini Rex breed (which I've heard is notorious for stasis issues)? Could she just have something inside that malfanctions and will require special treatment on a near-monthly basis for life??? (She's had several parasite tests; all were negative.)

Each time, I panic that it's an early sign of stasis. I don't know how long that I can wait to see signs of improvement before needing to get her to the vet's office. My heart can take much more of this....

Jenk

 

[Flashy]

I have a bun who does this quite regularly, but he has never had to be hospitalised, nor even needed vet treatment for it (that's just because of him as a bun, I know your buns are FAR more complex than mine which is probably why yours have needed treatment and mine haven't, nothing you are doing). What I do is the sign of any small poo he gets a lot of wet leafy greens to help him rehydrate his gut and keep very hydrated generally (I'm lucky in that he tolerates them well, but obviously not all buns do, not sure which of yours this is and whether she can tolerate greens or not). I also give him an additional water crock (I never used bottles anyway because they prevent a bunny from hydrating as quick as a bowl) with water laced with something yummy (sometimes a tiny dash of applie juice or cranberry juice, or when he's been more rough, 'basil water' where I just made my own water flavourbased on his favourite food) which encourages him to drink more and stay hydrated.

The time he was worst I syringed him water every couple of hours and his poos quickly settled down.

Maybe that might be a good place to start? Getting her more hydrated if she is still eating and acting normally?

 

[Jenk]

Flashy wrote:

Maybe that might be a good place to start? Getting her more hydrated if she is still eating and acting normally?

So you've found that additional water alone has helped your bun to start passing normal-sized fecals again?

Of my three bunnies, Emma's the only one who currently eats a wide variety of greens. (Thank goodness for small favors...)

During her October stasis bout, I began syringe-feeding her very watered-down Critical Care to get extra fluid to her gut.Because she had to be boarded at that same time, I also started her on Reglan (so that the woman boarding her could ensure that her gut continued to move). Not ideal, but I'm desperate here....

I gave her 30 cc's of it last night, even though she's eating wet, leafygreens and is still drinking an acceptableamount of water from her crock.

In the past, I have put a tiny amount of unsweetened apple juice in her water dish; but I'm always leery that any new sugar source might disrupt her gut flora.

My biggest problem is not knowing when to give up on "natural" methods of fighting stasis and resort to stronger ones (e.g., a vet visit, motility drugs, etc.). I don't want to wait too long only to have her hospitalized again.

 

[Maureen Las]

I agree with Flashy that there isn 't a reason to add critical care to hydrate her. Just give her water But if you are going to give it by syringe 30 ccs is way to much at once. Give her a few ccs every now and thenand if you can give her wet greens make them extra wet and cut out syringing the water altogether

A vet will say give 30 ccs of critical care 3 times perday. but if I ever did that I would have killed my rabbits from stressing them out. I give enough to keep the gut moving and not so much that they are heaving in a corner too fearful to get near me.
As long as you have an on-gong issue with stasis you should have your vet teach you to give subqutaneous fluids to them. it is not expensive and it saves the rabbit a whole of of the stress of having stuff forced down their throats.

Ihave a rabbit whose poops sometimes get smaller which sets off the" bells ringing" and I usually just give him more and wetter greens to remedy it. he has never been in stasis.

Your rabbits may have some anomalies in their GI tracts structurally(hard to know ) but it isn't probably anything that you will be able to get diagnosed definitely without spending a fortune which I know that you don't have.

 

[Flashy]

Yup, I'm found that hydration sorts it, providing there is no other cause (such as spurs, or something, if it is just fur and it has not progressed to anything serious, then yeh, water has always solved it for me).

I would suggest wet leafy greens dipped in water.

If you worry about the additional sugar causing a problems then you can make your own water. If she has a favourite herb or something you can cut it into tiny bits and leave that to soak in water, the water will take on the flavour and she might love it (might be a bit hit and miss as to what she likes though). Vanilla essence is another option.

I too was concerned about the sugar side, however I figured that the benefits outweighed the risks, and in my case they did, but I also know how rough a time you have had and could completely understand if you didn't want to touch it with a bargepole.

I also found that wet grass (if your bun can tolerate that) can be excellent for getting a bun out of the start of stasis.

Something else I tried along the way was floating the greens in water, and this, again, was another good way to get them to eat and drink more.

Have you ever learnt how to do Sub Q fluids? I'm not saying it's relevant in this situation, but if you learnt I bet it could benefit you and your bunnies greatly because I know (at least)Randy swears by it as a useful tool.

 

[Flashy]

My and angieluv posted at the same time, but at least we agreed, lol.

 

[Jenk]

Flashy wrote:

Have you ever learnt how to do Sub Q fluids? I'm not saying it's relevant in this situation, but if you learnt I bet it could benefit you and your bunnies greatly because I know (at least)Randy swears by it as a useful tool.

Technically, yes. During my other girl's previous appointment, the vet wanted to give her sub-Qs. I asked her to let me do it, and I did okay. But the thought of giving it a second try(at home) makes me nervous. And I don't yet know how I should purchase the supplies, which seem overly pricey for what you get from a vet's office.

 

[Maureen Las]

Flashy wrote:

My and angieluv posted at the same time, but at least we agreed, lol.

yeh but I never thought about flavoring the water with veggies ;that's a good idea!


Jenk,

the subqutaneous fluid looks harder than it really is. The one liter lactated ringers will last awhile for a rabbit . Rabbits get used to it .

 

[Jenk]

angieluv wrote:

I agree with Flashy that there isn 't a reason to add critical care to hydrate her. Just give her water But if you are going to give it by syringe 30 ccs is way to much at once. Give her a few ccs every now and thenand if you can give her wet greens make them extra wet and cut out syringing the water altogether.

The Critical Care isn't for hydrating her; it's to mildly flavor the water so that she'll drink it willingly from the syringe. (She won't do so with plain water.)

A vet will say give 30 ccs of critical care 3 times perday. but if I ever did that I would have killed my rabbits from stressing them out. I give enough to keep the gut moving and not so much that they are heaving in a corner too fearful to get near me.
As long as you have an on-gong issue with stasis you should have your vet teach you to give subqutaneous fluids to them. it is not expensive and it saves the rabbit a whole of of the stress of having stuff forced down their throats.

Again, the C.C. is so that we don't have to stress (fight with) her to take the fluids. So she's not hiding in a corner from us.

The vets I've worked with don't have a problem with 30 cc's of water being offered at one time. (My girls can drink about that much at one time from their crocks. They're really horses, I swear.)

(See my reply to Flashy re: sub-Qs.)

Ihave a rabbit whose poops sometimes get smaller which sets off the" bells ringing" and I usually just give him more and wetter greens to remedy it. he has never been in stasis.

Again, I'm just leery as to how long I can/should wait to see a difference from the extra fluids that I'm giving her (and/or how long to wait before administering sub-Qs).

Your rabbits may have some anomalies in their GI tracts structurally (hard to know ) but it isn't probably anything that you will be able to get diagnosed definitely without spending a fortune which I know that you don't have.

I suspect that Emma does have an anomaly.

As for spending a fortune, we've already done that ($7,700 of hard-earned savings gone within one year's time gone for the sake ofthree animals' care). Even if we had that kind of money to give again, we wouldn't. We've given up so much for ourselves, we're not even really living anymore....

 

[Flashy]

I definitely think that there is so much you can learn to do at home, which can help prevent hospitalisation.

I couple of weeks ago someone who adopted one of my former fosters e-mailed me frantically to tell me he wasn't pooing, eating and was hunched and lethargic.

I raced round with a heap of supplies but ready to call the vet if necessary. Me and her talked for a while, and we decided to give him Metacam, and some heat. I also forced her to relax (mainly by making jokes and such) and gave him some water.

He started to improve but on her instructions I called the vet to check he agreed with what I had done, which he did, and he said if he has not eaten or pooped for 24 hours it is at that point to take him in (this is a rabbit savvy vet).

By the next morning Harleyboy was fine. He was eating again, and pooing again, and it transpired that the owner had broken one of the first rules of rabbit owning without realising and given him some herbs he had not had before, and he ended up with a tummy ache.

Just by some very basic first aid measures I prevented him going into full stasis, and he was fine very quickly, and this may be one of those times. You have noticed very early and so hopefulyl with some good home care you won't need to take him to the vets. I know that situation was very different, but it did involve stasis and I was just explaining that simple measures can prevent a full blown emergency.

 

[Leaf]

Flashy wrote:

I definitely think that there is so much you can learn to do at home, which can help prevent hospitalisation.

I'm nowehere near that with rabbits (but yay for RO as a learning tool I can discuss with my vets when things arise to double and cross check) but am the same way when it comes to dogs.

 

[Jenk]

Flashy wrote:

I definitely think that there is so much you can learn to do at home, which can help prevent hospitalisation.

It's the timing of treatment (when to give/do what) that still eludes me a bit. But I completely agree that early home-based treatment is best--and not just because it saves money but because it saves the bun the stress of a vet visit.

I couple of weeks ago someone who adopted one of my former fosters e-mailed me frantically to tell me he wasn't pooing, eating and was hunched and lethargic.

I raced round with a heap of supplies but ready to call the vet if necessary. Me and her talked for a while, and we decided to give him Metacam, and some heat. I also forced her to relax (mainly by making jokes and such) and gave him some water.

I have Metacam on hand just in case any of my fur kids show signs of discomfort. So far, Emma's been active and eating, though (a definite plus).

Am I mistaken, or did I read somewhere that Metacam can cause digestive upset?

He started to improve but on her instructions I called the vet to check he agreed with what I had done, which he did, and he said if he has not eaten or pooped for 24 hours it is at that point to take him in (this is a rabbit savvy vet).

So, per this vet, zero poops within 24 hours' is serious business. But does that mean that smaller-than-normal poops are still (in a sense) okay, since fecal material is still being passed? Or is 24 hours' worth of smaller poops need for concern?

...It transpired that the owner had broken one of the first rules of rabbit owning without realising and given him some herbs he had not had before, and he ended up with a tummy ache.

That's one mistake I can't make, being as cautious as I must be with my herd. I start them with the tiniest piece of a new herb/veggie for several days' before slowly progressing to larger amounts.

Just by some very basic first aid measures I prevented him going into full stasis, and he was fine very quickly, and this may be one of those times.

I've literally felt scared about the thought of returning to full-time work (which I must do by the start of the New Year, at the latest).

I've told my hubby that he needs to become more observant/involved with the buns' dietary care (and stasis issues); I can't carry this stressful burden alone, especially not when away from the home for 10+ hours per day.

****

I know that I'm spastic about my rabbits' digestive issues. There are several reasons for this fact:

1) I had a vet who encouraged my dependence upon his care (andwho didn't tell me that I shouldn't be running them to him ever1.5 weeks', as I was doing).

2) It's pretty certain that I have an autoimmune disorder that promotes anxiety. (I've not had the disorder pinpointed yet, as I don't want to spend the money on the tests.)

3) I started out with a difficult rabbit breed, so I didn't have the luxury of adjusting to normal rabbit care from the get-go.

 

[Flashy]

You've had a really rough trot with your buns and it is SO natural you are on high alert for anything going wrong. I was going to mention about anxiety, but you beat me to it. I too have some pretty hefty anxiety problems, but even if I feel anxious I have to just force myself that I have to be calm around the buns. That can make the world of difference.

You have definitely had it harder than other new rabbit owners. It's unfortunate your vet didn't help you be more independent, but then I guess to him it's a business, as well as about animal care.

Our vets generally say 24 hours, HOWEVER, there are cases when obviously a bun needs to go in sooner than that, or when someone can deal with it for longer at home. My vet has sent me home with a bun before that he would have admitted for other people, but didn't for me, and we talked about what to do and when, and if things had gotten worse than I was to take him straight back the next morning for a drip and admission, but as it turned out, I used cranberry water and turned him around over night. He had spurs and didn't need emergency surgery, the drip and admission, he stayed on metacam for a week and had the operation once his gut was ok again.

I can't say about the small poos because each case is different, however small poo is a sign the gut is struggling, but still moving, so I guess each case is taken on an individal basis.

Yes, I believe metacam can cause gut problems, but then, same as everything else with buns, it comes to weighing up the risks. I can't obviously say to anyone else what they should do, but I would always ease pain if pain was there because of the high risk of the body shutting down whilst it is in pain.

I'm thinking something else I didn't suggest earlier would be encouraging Emma to do a lot of exercise (which may mean the others get less), and the more run she can have the better.

I really feel for you, so much

 

[Jenk]

Forgive the length of my reply, but you make some great points; I want to address them all.

Flashy wrote:

You've had a really rough trot with your buns and it is SO natural you are on high alert for anything going wrong. I was going to mention about anxiety, but you beat me to it. I too have some pretty hefty anxiety problems, but even if I feel anxious I have to just force myself that I have to be calm around the buns. That can make the world of difference.

I've discovered two ways of somewhat reducing my anxiety: 1) taking lengthy breaks from RO (and avoiding the Rainbow Bridge forum); 2) moving the bunnies out of the living room, so that I can't see them constantly throughout the day.

I try to be calm around the bunnies and think that I've been better on front; but I can relapse at times.

You have definitely had it harder than other new rabbit owners. It's unfortunate your vet didn't help you be more independent, but then I guess to him it's a business, as well as about animal care.

You've hit the nail on the head with regards to that particular vet....

Our vets generally say 24 hours, HOWEVER, there are cases when obviously a bun needs to go in sooner than that, or when someone can deal with it for longer at home. My vet has sent me home with a bun before that he would have admitted for other people, but didn't for me, and we talked about what to do and when, and if things had gotten worse than I was to take him straight back the next morning for a drip and admission, but as it turned out, I used cranberry water and turned him around over night. He had spurs and didn't need emergency surgery, the drip and admission, he stayed on metacam for a week and had the operation once his gut was ok again.

I want to reach that level of confidence, so that I can avoid hospitalization and care for my buns at home.

When you say spurs, are you referring to tooth issues?

I can't say about the small poos because each case is different, however small poo is a sign the gut is struggling, but still moving, so I guess each case is taken on an individal basis.

Outside of head (tooth) x-rays, I can't think of what else can be done to determine the cause of Emma's frequent small fecals.

Yes, I believe metacam can cause gut problems, but then, same as everything else with buns, it comes to weighing up the risks. I can't obviously say to anyone else what they should do, but I would always ease pain if pain was there because of the high risk of the body shutting down whilst it is in pain.

You're right, and I agree that I'd rather give Metacam to ease pain than to allow a bun to struggle with pain. (Emma does not handle even gas discomfort well.)

I'm thinking something else I didn't suggest earlier would be encouraging Emma to do a lot of exercise (which may mean the others get less), and the more run she can have the better.

It's a bit ofa pain, but we re-arrange/dismantle the NIC panels in their bedroom and put them along the hallway walls to allow them a longish/straight path to run at night. (Zoe will eat baseboards and door frames, so someone has to sit in the hallway with them for their entire time out because the panels don't cover all susceptible areas. As I've said, it's a bit of a pain....)

I really feel for you, so much

Part of me wants to thank you for that; part of me wishes that I had no reason to be pulling my hair out. :? At the end of the day, I most hatefeeling like there will come a time (much too early) when I fail my girls' in terms of their ongoing health issues. I'll either not have the money to deal with an issue, or I'll somehow miss something until it's too late....

 

[Flashy]

I've been flitting on and off the forum for the past few hours (inbetween rabbit related tasks) but this was the first post I checked this morning, and I wanted to give it a good amount of time to be able to give you a decent reply.

It's good you have found ways of reducing your anxiety. If being on RO makes you more anxious, maybe it might help to have people to contact from here if you need to? I found this to be really helpful. Me and Polly are very good friends and we have both contacted each other at different times to ask about X, Y, Z and what to do, or how to do something. For example, Polly has a vast amount of knowledge yet has not given sub-Q fluids and wanted some guidance on it, I was trained by my vet to do it, so just passed on the info. Likewise last year when Sky had his neuter (which was complex), it was Polly I asked for advice on the aftercare. There have obviously been many more times when we have shared info but I definitely think that sharing has made us both better owners and more knowledgable.

Do you have any techniques that help you reduce your anxiety? Like distraction? Rationalisation? Relaxation techniques? Medication?

The only way I became confident was just through learning and learning, then pushing my vet for more info and then learning some more, and only a little bit of practice. I know you are educating yourself a great deal and I would encrouage that even more. I often save RO threads to my favourites list if I think they have any sort of useful info in, I have saved many of Randy's posts to look back on as reference. Maybe making a virtual or actual folder with all sorts of info and what to do in different situations might be worth doing.

Yes, when I say spurs I'm talking about where the molars have grown and not worn down properly.

Just this morning I took Cloud to the vets, after noticing some gut problems on Saturday (slightly moist poo, lump in his gut) I took advantage of a prebooked appointment and asked for a checkup. He has gut slowdown, and its not working as well as it should, but he has been sent home so that I can get his gut back in good working order, Fibreplex, Metacam, lots of moist greens and lots of hay. His gut is not great, but it is functioning and so getting that is shape is more important than having his spur done, so that's what we are doing. That's just another indication that a gut problem doesn't have to mean automatic emergency admission or emergency measures or anything, they can be solved or sorted with simple means, often.

Having just said that, I don't think you have Fibreplex over there. It can be very useful for this type of problem. Maybe it might be worth seeing if you can get some delivered over there, or maybe me and you could work out a way to get you some.

There is a possibility that she does have spurs, in which case getting the vet to look with an Otoscope would be sensible, and if you are worried about tooth root problems then an x-ray is worth doing. Often though, the full extent of teeth problems can only be assessed under anaesthetic although a basic gist can be gotten whilst awake.

Are you by any chance a perfectionist? Or have low self esteem? Have you failed someone before?

The only reason I say that is because of your great worry or failing them. Do you think maybe this is the main reason why you are hypervigilant about any problems they might have?

What you must remember is that rabbit's are prey animal and so hide any sort of problem, and whilst we (as vigilant owners) often see them, we don't always. That does not mean we failed them, it means they out smarted us, or that they did what is in their instinct to do. It is how you deal with a problem when you notice it that is the important thing, and also learning from each situation. I know that's completely tricky to work out sometimes what a rabbit needs, when, why, how, but having a rabbit is a steep learning curve, even for seasoned owners. A lot of people are forced to deal with problems at home, and only seek help when there is no option. An example of that is Peg, whose nearest vet is 2 hours away or something (that's off the top of my head) and Peg has learnt to do a great deal of stuff at home through necessity, yet will make that trip if it comes to it. I think it is finding a balance and learning and knowing your girls and what works for them.

I imagine life is pretty scary for you now, in a lot of ways. Aside from the rabbit issues, do you have any sort of help for your anxiety problems?

 

[Jenk]

Flashy,

You're both awesome and astute.

Flashy wrote:

It's good you have found ways of reducing your anxiety. If being on RO makes you more anxious, maybe it might help to have people to contact from here if you need to? I found this to be really helpful.

I hadn't considered that as an option, but it's a very good suggestion. I'm not certain that I know anyone well enough for him/her to be willing to deal with my neurotic questions that crop up, though.

Do you have any techniques that help you reduce your anxiety? Like distraction? Rationalisation? Relaxation techniques? Medication?

None that I've been employing, no--unless you count me housing the buns out of my line-of-sight as a form of distraction.

The only way I became confident was just through learning and learning, then pushing my vet for more info and then learning some more, and only a little bit of practice. I know you are educating yourself a great deal and I would encrouage that even more. I often save RO threads to my favourites list if I think they have any sort of useful info in, I have saved many of Randy's posts to look back on as reference. Maybe making a virtual or actual folder with all sorts of info and what to do in different situations might be worth doing.

I feel as though I've soaked up so much info. from reading and talking to vets, but it still seems like it isn't enough. This stasis issue just seems to elude me and crop up too frequently for my comfort.

I've saved somethreads under my favorites list in the past, but should certainly do so with this one. Thank you for that reminder.

Just this morning I took Cloud to the vets, after noticing some gut problems on Saturday (slightly moist poo, lump in his gut) I took advantage of a prebooked appointment and asked for a checkup. He has gut slowdown, and its not working as well as it should, but he has been sent home so that I can get his gut back in good working order, Fibreplex, Metacam, lots of moist greens and lots of hay. His gut is not great, but it is functioning and so getting that is shape is more important than having his spur done, so that's what we are doing. That's just another indication that a gut problem doesn't have to mean automatic emergency admission or emergency measures or anything, they can be solved or sorted with simple means, often.

I can't gauge how long I can/should wait before freaking out over Emma's stasis (small poop) issues. Technically, she's had smaller-than-normal poops for 24 hours' now. (She has had some normal-sized ones, too; but her overnight output consists of nearly all smaller-than-normal ones.) It would seem that the extra fluids that we gave her yesterday and the extra-wet (pre-soaked) leafy greens that she got last night haven't helped much.

Having just said that, I don't think you have Fibreplex over there. It can be very useful for this type of problem. Maybe it might be worth seeing if you can get some delivered over there, or maybe me and you could work out a way to get you some.

No, we don't have Fibreplex here. But I'll look into the possibility of getting some. (Cost will be a factor, though.)

There is a possibility that she does have spurs, in which case getting the vet to look with an Otoscope would be sensible, and if you are worried about tooth root problems then an x-ray is worth doing. Often though, the full extent of teeth problems can only be assessed under anaesthetic although a basic gist can be gotten whilst awake.

Multiple past viewings with an otoscope have revealed no oral issues.

What confuses me is that she continues eating; it's not as though she stops due to mouth pain and then develops stasis.

Are you by any chance a perfectionist? Or have low self esteem? Have you failed someone before?

The only reason I say that is because of your great worry or failing them. Do you think maybe this is the main reason why you are hypervigilant about any problems they might have?

I am a perfectionist, yes. (I drive myself nuts, to be honest.) I did have low self-esteem as a child/teen. And I feel that I did, in a sense, "fail" our kitten, who had to be euthanized five years' ago when experimental treatment for a normally-fatal disease didn't work.

What you must remember is that rabbit's are prey animal and so hide any sort of problem, and whilst we (as vigilant owners) often see them, we don't always. That does not mean we failed them, it means they out smarted us, or that they did what is in their instinct to do. It is how you deal with a problem when you notice it that is the important thing, and also learning from each situation. I know that's completely tricky to work out sometimes what a rabbit needs, when, why, how, but having a rabbit is a steep learning curve, even for seasoned owners. A lot of people are forced to deal with problems at home, and only seek help when there is no option. An example of that is Peg, whose nearest vet is 2 hours away or something (that's off the top of my head) and Peg has learnt to do a great deal of stuff at home through necessity, yet will make that trip if it comes to it. I think it is finding a balance and learning and knowing your girls and what works for them.

I made 32 medical-relatedvisits to myformer vet--35 total visits, if you include picking up meds. To be honest, I'm also simply worn out from running to vet visits, for paying for vet visits. So every time that Emma's fecals get small, I get a knot in my stomach.

My hubby's the only one working right now and gets extra stressed (from a financial standpoint) every time the stasis bout hits. And while he is a nice guy, he gets cranky about the whole thing; so I feel stressed having to tell him that Emma may need another vet visit. I know that he won't act very supportive because he's focused on all of the past money spent on animals' care, which, to be fair, is an insane amount. (We could take several nice vacations that amount now gone.)

I imagine life is pretty scary for you now, in a lot of ways. Aside from the rabbit issues, do you have any sort of help for your anxiety problems?

I hadn't thought about it until now; yes, you're right: It's rather scary for me. I worry about the rabbits' health and the cost of their ongoing care; I worry about being able to get a job after the New Year; I worry that we may need to bomb our house, if this mite issue doesn't subside. (We already moved ourselves and the animals out once before, so that my hubby could spray the flooring/upholstery/curtains with a pesticide.)

Currently, I do not have help for my anxiety problems. And, to be honest, I hate America's health "insurance" policies, which still require that you pay more money after paying your deductible. So cost is a factor as to why I've not sought help. If I were working, I'd consider it.

 

[Flashy]

I would be happy for you to have my msn or e-mail address and to poke me if you have a question/need some advice. I can't promise to know the answer, but I'll always do the best I can, and if necessary, could post for you if you felt unable to come on. It's [email protected]

I have a feeling this how you feel about this, and how hypervigilant you are is actually not really to do with the buns, but to do with the kitten you feel you failed before. The fact they are a different type of animal adds another dimension to it too.

Often when we lose an animal we get remaining guilt. I know I have a great deal of unbearable guilt from losing some of the buns I have in the ways they died, and it due to that guilt I've gone on some sort of education crusade to learn as much as possible. I now know that not one of those mistakes would ever happen again, ever, because of what I have learnt. It doesn't right the wrongs, but it balances it out a bit in a weird way, and they didn't die in vain, because their death has helped many rabbits. You haven't had a chance to balance in the same way because you are struggling with this guilt with a different type of animal, so you are just trying to go from scratch and not make any sort of mistakes for fear of losing the animal. Or at least, that's how it sounds (so feel free to correct me).

You just sound petrified of being to blame for anything happening to them.

Small poo in itself shows that the gut is not happy, but also, not in stasis, because it is still moving. It took a few days to right when we gave mine flavoured water, but it did right, it was just a case of persevering, in that instance. Whether or not you choose to persevere is up to you. Is she acting completely normal in herself?

If she has no spurs, then the issue might be tooth roots, but I suspect you would be seeing signs like eye problems and nasal discharge ahead of gut problems. It might just be she has a sensitive tummy, or else she is feeling your anxiety and so is tense in herself.

It must be hard having to battle through this effectively coping with the strain of this alone. I can relate in a way, but I also know that those who lean on me the most from the RSPCA deal with their bun's issues alone and need that reassurance, because it IS very stressful (as you know).

In terms of dealing with your anxiety there are lots of things you can do away from your health system, for example there might be anxiety support groups in your area (a google search should find any, and they are normally free), also there are good books you can try and use. Cognitive Behavioural Therapy is often used to help with anxiety and this is a great book (I have this, although haven't used it for a variety of reasons, but it's what the practitioners over here use and they have their own copy to work alongside the clients copy). http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mind-Over-Mood-Change-Changing/dp/0898621283/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1228143479&sr=8-1

Also there are books, websites, resources, helplines on relaxation techniques, complementary therapies, etc. There is a load of help out there that you can access without even going near a doctor (I'm not saying you shouldn't but I do understand the financial factor).

ETA, I just found these too, they might also be useful. http://www.mentalhealth.org.uk/information/wellbeing-podcasts/

 

[Jenk]

Flashy wrote:

I would be happy for you to have my msn or e-mail address and to poke me if you have a question/need some advice. I can't promise to know the answer, but I'll always do the best I can, and if necessary, could post for you if you felt unable to come on. It's [email protected].

Flashy, stating the obvious again but...You're awesome. :biggrin2:

I've long felt guilty for being barely active on RO--except to pop in and reply to a few upbeat posts along with posting my own health-related questions. But I do find that not lurking on this forum (out-of-sight, out-of-mind) somewhat reduces my fixation on the topic of rabbit health issues.

I have a feeling this how you feel about this, and how hypervigilant you are is actually not really to do with the buns, but to do with the kitten you feel you failed before. The fact they are a different type of animal adds another dimension to it too.

I don't know if that's it entirely, but I'm open to the possibility.Even now, I remember thesix-week period that I spent trying to nurse our kitten to health, only to watch her weaken (and us having toresort to euthanasia).

...I have a great deal of unbearable guilt from losing some of the buns I have in the ways they died, and it due to that guilt I've gone on some sort of education crusade to learn as much as possible. I now know that not one of those mistakes would ever happen again, ever, because of what I have learnt. It doesn't right the wrongs, but it balances it out a bit in a weird way, and they didn't die in vain, because their death has helped many rabbits. You haven't had a chance to balance in the same way because you are struggling with this guilt with a different type of animal, so you are just trying to go from scratch and not make any sort of mistakes for fear of losing the animal. Or at least, that's how it sounds (so feel free to correct me).

Crusade...That's an accurate term for my way of dealing with Savannah's loss. I throw myself into learning as much as possible about my pets' symptoms, their causes, ways to relieve them, etc. Yet, for all of my working knowledge, I still go into panic-mode when Emma's gut slows down. Oy...

You just sound petrified of being to blame for anything happening to them.

I started crying when I read this statement. I'm guessing that means you've hit the nail on the head, so to speak.

Ironically, I recently told my husband that when I return to work, he needs to be more involved with regards to observing the bunnies'. As it stands, I'm the only one who really keeps track of the amount of food that they eat, their fecal output, etc. So even though the buns have two owners, I currently carry the burden that if something were to go seriously wrong with them, it would be all my fault (since I'm the one being vigilant about their care).

Small poo in itself shows that the gut is not happy, but also, not in stasis, because it is still moving. It took a few days to right when we gave mine flavoured water, but it did right, it was just a case of persevering, in that instance. Whether or not you choose to persevere is up to you. Is she acting completely normal in herself?

When I got up this morning and found a box of small fecals, I called the vet's office. (I want/need to get to the bottom of this, as best as possible.) So I'm taking her in this evening, despite the snow on the ground (ugh).

I want to perservere--for Emma's gut to perservere--but it feels futile whenever her gut does this sofrequently.

She seemed a bit uncomfy based on the way that she was lying down; I've started giving her Simethicone. She perked up shortly thereafter and is still eating/drinking. Still, I think that I'll keep the vet appointment; I want to see what this new vet has to say about this ongoing issue.

If she has no spurs, then the issue might be tooth roots, but I suspect you would be seeing signs like eye problems and nasal discharge ahead of gut problems. It might just be she has a sensitive tummy, or else she is feeling your anxiety and so is tense in herself.

She's never had runny eyes, but she has had moisture beneath her nose. I wouldn't call it a heavy nasal discharge; it never ran down to her mouth or anything like that. So it never seemed overly worrisome; but I'll discuss the possibility with the vet tonight.

It must be hard having to battle through this effectively coping with the strain of this alone. I can relate in a way, but I also know that those who lean on me the most from the RSPCA deal with their bun's issues alone and need that reassurance, because it IS very stressful (as you know).

Based on my past/current rabbit experiences, I'm certain that I could not withstand bun ownership entirely on my own. I say that not only from a(n) emotional/psychological standpoint, but also from a financial one.

In terms of dealing with your anxiety there are lots of things you can do away from your health system....

Thank you so much for the information; I will definitely put it to use. God only knows, any form of help is better than none at all. And trying to cope alone isn't beneficial when you're experiencing anxiety. (You know that you're experiencing it, that your thoughts/feelings are rather illogical; yet you can't stop yourself.)

...There is a load of help out there that you can access without even going near a doctor (I'm not saying you shouldn't but I do understand the financial factor).

Until I can visit a bona-fide doctor, learning other coping mechanisms is a valid option. To be honest, I get so wrapped up in my thoughts/anxiety, I tend to not consider finding help for myself. But you're right that I should do so. Because if I'm completely shot, then I've nothing to even offer my animals.

 

[Bo B Bunny]

Bo tends to get the small poops - so does Clover sometimes. I just give them some banana (just a tiny bite) each day or papaya (dried) and it seems to help - they drink A LOT of water tho.

 

[Jenk]

Bo B Bunny wrote:

Bo tends to get the small poops - so does Clover sometimes. I just give them some banana (just a tiny bite) each day or papaya (dried) and it seems to help - they drink A LOT of water tho.

Thankfully, two of my bunners are good water drinkers. Emma is normally, but she seems to always decrease her water intake when going through these stasis bouts. Ack...