is it ok to breed pet store bunnies?

[sweetasme007]

THANK YOU, gypsy.

what does "peanut" mean? do they look like peanuts?

nichole

 

This baby is whats called apeanut , he was the same age as the onein my left hand ,more thantwice as small , they donot usually survive beyond afew days , I was able to keep this onegoing for 8 days , It broke myheart when I found his mothrhas dispatched him during the night ,.I cannot express enough about these tinybabies , they will break your heart , Ihadonly one and it was enough ,its not unusual for Dwarfs andMini's to carry this fatalgene. breeding any type of a dwarf rabbithas this risk and one best left tothe experts , I cannot commenton Max Factor Babies Ihavent had one thankfully , also to keepthe record straight , I do notbreed the mother came in as rescue , Itwas a shock to go down one dayand find babies , I had no clue, It was more of a shock when 2days later I found the little one , I had noidea he was even there till hebrushed by my hand.

 

[sweetasme007]

there is no "breeders something or nother" on the left hand side...

 

[Trina]

What wonderful baby buns you havethere, Gypsy! My prayers go for your buns and for couragious peanut.

 

[cirrustwi]

I'm sorry, I missed your question about where tofind breeders, somehow. Try doing a search for whatever typeof rabbit breeders in Tennessee. (I know that's a littlestrange. For example, when I was looking for Flemish GiantBreeders, I searched for Flemish Giant breeders in PA.)There's also another site...I'll look and see if I can find it...Ican't remember it at the moment.

I found it: http://www.bunnyrabbit.org/rabbitbreeders

Jen

 

[dajeti2]

Here is a link that describes and shows what a peanut looks like.

http://rabbitinfocenter.8m.com/peanut.html

Here is a link thst describes Max Factor babies.

http://rabbitinfocenter.8m.com/maxfactor.html

Here is the Netherland Dwarf Club's website

http://www.andrc.com/

Tina

Oh boy, there's our baby. Darling,We miss you baby.:tears2:

 

[rabbitgirl]

sweetasme007 wrote:

and by "moon eyes" i mean there is nodischarge comming from their eyes, but the color of her eyes are a hazylight grey, almost like someone with cataracts.

That sounds like another forum member's rabbit, Nimue. He's an albinoFlemish Giant, and his eyes turned cloudy purple at around 3 months, Ithink. He gets around just fine though. Do you get a reaction when youwave in her line of sight?

I have blind and partially blind rabbits who are not albino, and by andlarge they do just fine. The cloudy grey can be seen only intheir pupils, while the iris is brown, unlike Amy's Nimue, whose eyesare fully light purple/grey, iris and pupil (from what I can tell bypics anyway).

I'd guess that would be your biggest deterrent tobreeding.:?Not that blind rabbits are bad or anything (I havethem too!), but you'd probably end up with blind kits if she carriesthat gene.

Maybe you want to try some experiments to tell how much she can see, if anything. Does she run into walls?

Good luck!

Rose

 

[seniorcats]

Nichole, I think you are doing the really smartthing by researching the topic in advance and asking people withexperience. The ARBA link that was listed is a great place tofind breeder information and links to clubs and groups in your state.

I guess I was just worried because I've had friends who had accidentallitters or planned litters from non-pedigreed rabbits and they ended upwith all sorts of heartbreak - dead babies, bottle feeding, no homes,etc.

Once your bunnies reach the age of 4 to 6 months, they go through a'teenage' stage and can bereally bratty andrambunctious - it's a hormonal thing.... but theyare still endearing.

You have come to the right place to learn more about rabbits. Welcome to the forum! :wave:

 

[imported_Austin]

A true dwarf rabbit has one normal gene and onedwarfing gene. There are purebred dwarf rabbits out therethat do not have the dwarfting gene - just two normal genes.These get larger than the true dwarf rabbits and are referred to asBUDs (big ugly does) or BUBs (big ugly bucks). Peanuts arebabies that get 2 dwarfing genes. These babies aregenetically unable to survive more than a few days. Peanutswill always die no matter what you may try to do to savethem. Some breeders remove them from the litter at birth anddispose of them humanely - others leave them since there are usuallyonly 2 or 3 babies in a dwarf litter and the peanut can have some valueas added warmth to the nest until it's siblings are a few days old andstart getting fur. If you ever get apeanut thatlives, it was a runt and not a true peanut. Goingall out to savea peanut is a wasted effort. Youwill never be sucessfull at it. Max Factors are adifferant type of genetic abnormality. All max factors can betraced back to one netherland buck imported from Europe. Maxfactors are born with any number of problems but the most common arefroggy type of back legs, eyes open at birth, missing top portion ofskull ect... Fortunately for breeders, any litter that has amax factor in it also usuallyhas other babies that makeincredible show rabbits. They posess a dwarfier look, betterheads, limbs, and the fur is somewhat longer. Some maxfactors are born dead and some have been known to live for awhile butthey usually always sucumb before weaning.

When the original poster said that albino rabbits have geneticproblems, I would like to know what those problems are. Theyare differant in that they see things differantly than rabbits withcolored eyes but in all my 25+ years of raising rabbits, I have neverheard that albino (Ruby eyed White) rabbits have geneticproblems. I have quiet a few in my barn now that areperfectly normal and have perfectly normal babies. If youhave REW rabbits with genetic problems, I would tend to believe itis genetic problems that just happen to be in your REWrabbits -not necessarily a blanket problem that is just forREWS. As always though, reguardless of what you run into whenyou breed your rabbits, it is up to the breeder to not manifest theproblem by breeding more of the same. Rabbits that are notgenetically healthy should not be bred.

People that come to me and say they want to breed rabbits for pets, Itell them that it is not a good idea - for the very reasons that havealready been listed. There will never be enough good pethomes for all of the rabbits already being put into the petmarked. It has been estimated that only 1 out of 10 rabbitsfinds a home for life. Most pet rabbits loose that first homeas soon as they grow up. Then it is the rare rabbit thatfinds a happy life from there. Most people are just not thatresponsible as pet rabbit owners. That is why there are somany out there sitting in shelters and rescue organizations.While your friends and family may thing your rabbits are cute, rabbitsalso live for up to 10 years, and for9 1/2 of those years,they are not cute little babies anymore. Enjoy yourbabies and tell your friends to go find their own.

 

[sweetasme007]

no she doesn't run into walls but she doesnt'seem to see completey. i have waved my hand in her sight likeyou would a blind person, but she seems to see somewhat...i'm not a vet but i do plan to have her checked. can the vets tell anymore than i can by waving their hands in her eyes?

 

[seniorcats]

Austin wrote:

People that come to me and say they want to breed rabbits for pets, Itell them that it is not a good idea - for the very reasons that havealready been listed. There will never be enough good pethomes for all of the rabbits already being put into the petmarked. It has been estimated that only 1 out of 10 rabbitsfinds a home for life. Most pet rabbits loose that first homeas soon as they grow up. Then it is the rare rabbit thatfinds a happy life from there. Most people are just not thatresponsible as pet rabbit owners. That is why there are somany out there sitting in shelters and rescue organizations.While your friends and family may thing your rabbits are cute, rabbitsalso live for up to 10 years, and for9 1/2 of those years,they are not cute little babies anymore. Enjoy yourbabies and tell your friends to go find their own.

I really enjoyed reading your post. An observation:I have had pet house rabbits for 17 years. In all thoseyears, I never actually went to a rescue to adopt or to a breeder tobuy. Every one of my 10 rabbits - soon to 11 - have beenrehomed to me from people who no longer wanted them or could no longerkeep them. Most of my bunnies were Easter purchasesor pet store purchases that were no longer wanted bytheirowners.

I have always wanted to get a Flemish from a breeder or go to a rescueto adopt but that opportunity has not presented itself yet.

 

[seniorcats]

sweetasme007 wrote:

no she doesn't run into walls but she doesnt' seem to seecompletey. i have waved my hand in her sight like you would ablind person, but she seems to see somewhat... i'm not a vetbut i do plan to have her checked. can the vets tell any more thani can by waving their hands in her eyes?

Depending on the vet and the types of instruments they have, they cantell how much light is entering the eye and how much the animal isseeing.One of my senior cats goes to a veterinaryopthamologist in Richfield, Ohio. He has all sorts ofspecialized instruments. A good rabbit savyvetshould be able to give you an idea on the vision.

http://www.rabbit.org/Has information on finding vets who treat rabbits.

 

[rabbitgirl]

sweetasme007 wrote:

no she doesn't run into walls but she doesnt' seem to seecompletey. i have waved my hand in her sight like you would ablind person, but she seems to see somewhat... i'm not a vetbut i do plan to have her checked. can the vets tell any more thani can by waving their hands in her eyes?

Mine can see light and shadow too. Also, she may lose what she has down the road--who knows?

Did you wave your hand in front or on the side? If you tried in front,try the side, and make sure you're not close enough to brush whiskers.They use those as "eyes" which is why some blind rabbits are so amazingat navigating obstacles. Wouldn't it be handy if blind people hadthose....

Plus, remember that all rabbits have "blind spots", if I remembercorrectly. I think one was directly in front of the nose. That's whythe side test works better.

Can you post pics of her eyes? That might help...maybe they are just a funny color???

Rose

 

[rabbitgirl]

Austin wrote:

Atrue dwarf rabbit has one normal gene and one dwarfing gene.There are purebred dwarf rabbits out there that do not have thedwarfting gene - just two normal genes. These get larger thanthe true dwarf rabbits and are referred to as BUDs (big ugly does) orBUBs (big ugly bucks).

Hey! That's so mean!

lol, I have one of those, Holland doe. She's around 6 lbs. at peak. Heryoungsters carry dwarf/normal, in fact the buck is only about 3 lbs.Tiny little squirt.

But she "ain't ugly".

Thanks for the genetics explanation. It's always fascinating.

Rose

 

[ayglnu13]

Hey!

I'm Amy, the girl Rose (rabbitgirl) was talking about

This is Nimue

And he is completely blind. Ignore the brown on his mouth (he was digging )

If your rabbit is truly blind she may passdown that trait to her children, and what is the point of a blindlitter?

Nimue is blind but he usually doesn't runinto walls or anything (unless he is in a room he hasn't been inbefore) your doe may know her way around so well that she seems likeshe isn't blind. The easiest way to tell if they are blind is if theyhave a white or milky film covering their eyes, even if she doesn't shestill could be blind.

Some vets will know how to check forblindness, others wont. You will need to find a rabbit savvy vet beforeyou even think of breeding.

I recently (like 4 months ago) had alitter of baby Hollands. Here is what I spent on my lastlitter.

She had a litter of 5 babies:

At 2 weeks they all had to go to the vet for a check up = - $60

At 4 weeks one of the babies had to go in for a check up = - $35

Sold 3 babies for $30 each =+$90

Another baby had a spinal injury and was brought to the vets = - $200

Then the baby passed away.

So in all I made a - $205

Breeding rabbits definitely wont make youany money, it will actually cause you to loose money.

If you have any questions please feel free to PM me

~Amy

 

[imported_Austin]

If your Ruby Eyed White rabbits are going blindor what not - it is not a normal thing. There is somethingmessed up in the genetics of your rabbits. Normal REW rabbitsshould be able to live happy, healthy, normal lives just like any otherrabbit out there. The only thing with them is that the albinoeye does not focus like a normal colored eye does and that is why youwill see them sitting and 'swaying'. They are doing what iscalled scanning but this is normal. It is how they focus inon what they are looking at. The rumour has beengoing around the rabbit community for years - decades probably - thatREW rabbits have genetic problems. Normal, well bred ones donot. As with any other rabbit breed and variety out there,there can be genetic defects that the inexperienced breeder does notnotice or does not care about and then go on to breed more of the samesorts of problems. Only breed the healthiest of rabbits andonly those that you can be fairly certain do not carry some weirddefect. Netherland dwarf rabbits of any variety seem to bethe worst offenders (if you will) for giving birth to any number of oddthings - yet alot of the breeders keep breeding them just toget that one baby that does not show signs of those specificproblems. That one normal looking baby still carriesthe defective genetics. Theknowledgeable, good breeders will not risk something stupid in theirherd and will not breed that questionable rabbit even if it is a grandchampion.

 

Austin You soundfamilar , Are you a Vet ? orare you a Breeder orare you both ? curious .

 

[imported_Austin]

I have been breeding rabbits for the past 25 orso years for show. I have been breeding dwarf hotots for thepast 8 years. In college, my major was genetics as they applyto the farming community - animals and genetic relatedtraits(defects as well as the desirable), and I studied the genetics of foodplants as they pertain to farming. Though I am not all thatgenetically literate when it comes to the colors and what happens whenthis color is bred to that color, I do know about the genetic relateddefects as well as desireable traits as they pertain toanimals. One day maybe I'll have time to work on the colorsas well. Rabbits are a true joy in my life as are the manyfriends I've made in the rabbit community. They are also afrustration at times because when I realize that there is a potentialgenetic problem introduced by a new rabbit or rabbits into the herd, itcan be heartbreaking to realize that alot of hard work now needs to becorrected - which usually means the removal of said rabbits from theherd as well as their offspring. By taking only a hard linecan you keep the genetic health and vitality of your animalsstrong. Too many breeders just don't care about the over allpicture - just whatthey can do towin on thetables. I want to win but I also want to be breeding a strongherd. What I sell then goes on to others who want the samething for their herds. I want my pet quality rabbits to behealty and live an enjoyable life, not be a constant source offrustration for their new owners. There is a way to raisegood rabbits for the pet market but most do not want to do what ittakes - they are only interested in the dollars.

 

Thank You for takingthe time to explain its appreciated, I have no anything ingenetics , I have only had to deal withone peanut in 20 years , asI mentioned it came in as arescue and the mother was a mini andwho knows what thefather was , I definately agree that itis heartbreaking when one comesalong , I was and still amdevistated by the loss , asare a goodly number of this forum ,to say they went thru my hell withme is only barely scratching the surface,

It was a good fight and he wasactualy growing a tiny tinybit but to him and me and thisforum it was milestones , As Istated in one other thread , My Vet islooking into the different degrees ofpeanuts , Im hoping I was rightinthe fact that like genetic disordersin children there is Varyingdegrees with rabbits and other animals.

Had the Mother not dispatchedit one night I truelybelieve he had a fighting chance ofsurviving a few more days maybeeven weeks , I know only prolongingthe pain and hurt of losing himlater, But I honestly feel Ingiving him the chance to trywas one of the best thingsI could have done for him andfor us , I feel it gave us achance to experience a true love andrespect for trying tothrive .

Im not sure how others feel about allthis but to dispatch with out knowing ifit could have survived and leda normal life justseems wrong to me .

 

[imported_Austin]

There are somebreeders who remove themat birth but I leave them in the nest if I find them alive.It may be a cruel dose of fate for them but God put them here and ifthey can help keep the rest of the babies warm for a fewdays(since dwarfs only have 2 or 3 anyway), I feel theirlittle lives have some value. There is no degree ofpeanuts, only degrees of damage to a baby born with the double dwarfinggene. Some will hang on longer than others but it is alwaysfatal. I do nothing for them to help them survive - it justprolongs the inevitable. They will always die but I donothing to bring along the end to them quicker either. I hadone live for around a month. It grew fur, opened it's eyes,and came out of the nest box but in the end, it looked weak andmiserable and I was alittle relieved when it finally passed away.