Cut Off Age for Fixing?

[lilnaugrim]

Hey all, new to the forum, have a few questions!

Looked around first and didn't quite find my answer, so here's the question!

Is there a cut off age for fixing a rabbit?

My new bun, Wiki, is an English Lop. I'm aware that males do not need to be fixed but would like to get him a friend down the road, perhaps next year or so. He's currently just over a year old or so the owner tells me, she said she got him at 12 weeks old. She said she didn't know if he's been fixed or not, never brought him to the vet or anything. So my first step is to bring him in for a checkup to check things out. So I'll update after I do that.

Wiki is a good bunbun, no spraying, humping, or poop scenting yet. I know also that fixing could change behaviors after fixing as well but it's a risk I would like to take in order to get him a friend down the road.

The other question is if two fixed males would cohabitate? I'm familiar with reptiles and the answer to that question would be no lol. It's either female/female, male/female, or male/females. But bunnies are different? Does the second male have to be neutered as well, though, I would probably do it for the likelihood of good habits and safety.

Hope this is the proper subforum to ask this.
Thanks in advance folks!

 

[Aki]

One year old is a good age to neuter, no problem. It won't change his personality - that's a myth. I think a lot of people see a change in behavior because we generally neuter when the rabbit is a teenager and the apparition of the adult personality is wrongly attributed to the neuter. I've never seen the slightest change in behavior in any of my rabbits after spaying / neutering... except for, you know, no more humping / spraying / growling and stuff ^^.
A big no to the idea of bringing a second male. I've known a couple of people who did it successfully but it generally doesn't work and even when it does the pairing is generally not stable (fights occur regularly because a top rabbit is difficult to establish with that kind of pairing so, you have to expect regular coups except if you lucked out and got a very dominant buck with a very submissive one - if you search the forum, you'll find a plethora of threads called 'Help, rabbits are suddenly fighting!' and yeah... it's great you're asking before attempting anything ^^'). I think the problem is that it's not a natural configuration. Warrens are matriarchies and the top rabbit is almost always female... this is why 2 females is also an unwise pairing to attempt, as females can be very territorial. A neutered male welcoming a spayed female (don't put an intact female with your buck even if he's neutered, they will fight and he will attempt to mate anyway which could end really badly) on his territory is the best configuration possible. Bucks are generally delighted to have a doe on their territory (it's not always true in reverse ^^') so chances are it will go well pretty easily. If you can, getting an already spayed female from a rescue would be ideal (age and breed don't matter) as you won't have to wait until she is old enough to spay (around 7 months) and after she heals (about a month after surgery) to introduce them.

 

[lilnaugrim]

Thanks for the reply!

Yep, I'm a mod on a fish forum and I see a lot of "I put a male betta with my females and they killed the male, why?" so yeah >.< Definitely want to make sure it's possible before attempting anything.

Yes, I've read about bringing bunbun to a rescue group and making a playdate to see if he likes any of the other buns. I think that's the best idea. I would love to rescue one for sure! This guy was given to me by a friend and was totally free with all the bells and whistles (planning to make a bunny safe room. He gets free roam while I'm home. Big cage for when I'm at work).

So a male/female (both fixed) is workable?
I do plan to get a dog down the road (few years likely) so maybe I should wait and see if they'll bond? I've seen that happen. But I also see that many recommend having at least a pair of bunnies, especially since I'm at work 8 hours a day plus half hour travel time each way. Just want to make sure he's got the best that I can offer!

I am kind of hoping for a Lionhead if I do get another bunbun, I adore their manes! Still need to do research though! I know my SPCA always has buns available (I see them each time I go in for one of our Tropical Fish meets lol). They had a big Angora bun there this month.

 

[ladysown]

just remember this... not all bunnies get along (just like with people).

when bringing in a second bun be alert to illnesses.

 

[lilnaugrim]

just remember this... not all bunnies get along (just like with people).

when bringing in a second bun be alert to illnesses.

Of course, just like all other animals too!
I have experience introducing cats, leopard geckos, fish (you might not think this hard but it certainly can be just as difficult as introducing cats!), and more.

Is it possible (I assume) that some bunnies will also never get along with other bunnies? I would also assume that due to their highly social nature that, it would be very rare.

Apologies for getting off topic here!

But just so I'm sure (even though I want to do it asap), it's possible to snip a male bunny at any age then? Even if he was like say, four or five? Just to appease my curiosity ^_^

 

[Aki]

The advantage of a rescue or a forster family is also that the bunny will probably have been quarantined already ^^.
It's true not all rabbits get along, but desexed male / female introduced carefully (I advise you to look up the House Rabbit Society website which has good articles about everything and bonding in particular) generally goes over well even if it's more or less easy depending on the individuals. In a lot of rescues, you can exchange the rabbit you took in if the pairing doesn't go well, which is also a plus. Yes, some rabbits never take to each other. I remember someone who had a group of rabbits (they had one, lost it, bought another one, the first one reappeared unexpectedly in their garden and they had a litter which they decided to keep after neutering / spaying everyone) and all the rabbits got along except for one bunny who was hated by all the others. They had to separate him because he was fighting with everyone. I've also known a bunny or two who really hated other rabbits. It can happen.
I never did the meet and great thing before taking a new bunny home as I think it's unecessary, stressful for your bunny and not really a good indicator of anything considering the bunnies are absolutely not in situation (but not everyone agrees with me on that) and my pairing always worked. I got the love at first sight case but also cases which took weeks and included chasing / fur flying / growling. It always solved itself. My current pair really didn't like each other at first. They've now been living together for 4 years and cuddle, groom and are great together - my buck even played caretaker for my doe when she lost her sight last year and really helped her get her bearings.

You can neuter a bunny at any age. The problem is not with the neuter but with the anesthesia. Most vets won't do it before 4 months because the smaller the rabbit is the riskier it is, and generally it is said that it's best to do it while the rabbit is at the peak of his health and before the bad habits have set in (so, around 1 year old). But rescues do it with much older rabbits all the time. The anesthesia risk is actually pretty low (around 0.5% from the numbers I have) and generally, the death occur because the rabbit had a heart problem that went undetected before. The neuter in itself is a quick and simple operation.
Does are trickier because the operation is a lot heavier and that after 2 or 3 years chances are the vet will have to remove the whole uterus as cancers can come early (the risk increases each year to attain over 80% at 5 years old). So generally, it is better to spay around 7 - 8 months old for smaller breeds and 1 year old for bigger breeds. But then again, rescues do it later regularly when they get intact females. You just need a really good vet and to be prepared to the fact that the recovery might be a bit slow and hard.

 

[lilnaugrim]

Thanks again Aki!

I'll look into those articles you mentioned.

And I do also kind of agree with you on the meet and greet thing. It's stressful for almost any animal to leave home and then to be suddenly surrounded by foreign animals? It won't show true results which can skew judgment. Different for dogs though that routinely are practiced in going out and such, though detrimental if you don't socialize your animal right off the bat!

And good to know.

Yeah, I'm not worried about the anesthesia. If death occurs then it occurs; nothing I can do to prevent that. I love my animals, don't get me wrong, but I'd much rather face the odds. And yeah, males of any animal are always easiest haha.

I have a good vet recommendation from here actually and was presented with a 50% off coupon for our first visit! Pretty excited!

 

[Aki]

That's great! I hope everything goes well!
But yeah, it's different with dogs... as long as mine gets to go out and do things, he's thrilled, even if it's going to the vet (not always that thrilled once he's there but he gets over it immediately ^^). On the other hand, with rabbits, I got a few GI stasis cases after a vet visit or even strangers coming to my house so I'm pretty cautious about the stress thing.

 

[JBun]

One year old is a good age to neuter, no problem. It won't change his personality - that's a myth. I think a lot of people see a change in behavior because we generally neuter when the rabbit is a teenager and the apparition of the adult personality is wrongly attributed to the neuter. I've never seen the slightest change in behavior in any of my rabbits after spaying / neutering... except for, you know, no more humping / spraying / growling and stuff ^^.
A big no to the idea of bringing a second male. I've known a couple of people who did it successfully but it generally doesn't work and even when it does the pairing is generally not stable (fights occur regularly because a top rabbit is difficult to establish with that kind of pairing so, you have to expect regular coups except if you lucked out and got a very dominant buck with a very submissive one - if you search the forum, you'll find a plethora of threads called 'Help, rabbits are suddenly fighting!' and yeah... it's great you're asking before attempting anything ^^'). I think the problem is that it's not a natural configuration. Warrens are matriarchies and the top rabbit is almost always female... this is why 2 females is also an unwise pairing to attempt, as females can be very territorial. A neutered male welcoming a spayed female (don't put an intact female with your buck even if he's neutered, they will fight and he will attempt to mate anyway which could end really badly) on his territory is the best configuration possible. Bucks are generally delighted to have a doe on their territory (it's not always true in reverse ^^') so chances are it will go well pretty easily. If you can, getting an already spayed female from a rescue would be ideal (age and breed don't matter) as you won't have to wait until she is old enough to spay (around 7 months) and after she heals (about a month after surgery) to introduce them.

My opinion and experience differs. It's inaccurate to say that a change of personality after a neuter is a myth. It might not be what you personally have experienced, but you can't just say that others accounts of this happening aren't true and that it might have had nothing to do with the rabbit going from teenager to adult. And I can verify this statement as fact since it happened to one of my rabbits who was older when he got neutered, so has nothing to do with maturing from teenager to adult. I can tell you that it is not a myth and can in fact happen. It doesn't usually happen, but it certainly is a possibility.

It's also inaccurate to state that you shouldn't put a neutered buck with an unspayed female or they will fight. Sure that could happen, as it could also happen with a neutered buck and a spayed doe, but there are plenty of instances that I know of, where no fighting occurs and the rabbits get along just fine. Again, this is from my own experience of having a neutered buck bonded with an unspayed doe for some time until I could get her spayed. They got along perfectly fine, never fought, and were perfectly happy together both prespay and post spay. I also know of others that have had an unspayed female with a neutered buck, without any issues occurring. It's all down to individual personalities. It's usually not recommended, especially for beginners, as fixed rabbits won't have the hormones complicating the bonding process, but there are instances of it working out fine. This isn't to say I don't recommend getting pet female rabbits spayed. It's best for their health, but I and other's have successfully had fixed males with unspayed females until the female could get spayed.

As for pairing, male/female is usually considered the best, but it really all comes down to the individual personalities of the rabbits and finding the right match that way. Though male/male and female/female pairings are considered to be more likely to have issues, it's not always the case and there can be m/m f/f that get along great. I had two females together that were perfectly happy and never had issues, I also have a group of 6 that contains 3 males that get along perfectly, and know of others that have m/m pairings that worked out just fine. It's just all about finding the right rabbit for your current one. You could have a female/male pairing that ends up being a disaster if you don't find the right match for your bun. You need to find the right match of personalities regardless of gender.

Bunny dates really are the best way to go. If you could do it in your own home in a neutral area where your rabbit hasn't claimed it's territory, that of course is ideal. But it doesn't usually work out that way, and most often you have to take your rabbit somewhere for the date. Or you take a risk and just bring a bunny home and hope for the best. If you can't return the bunny if it doesn't work out, you need to be prepared to keep both rabbits separate, or to rehome the other bun.

Lilnaugrim, if you opt for bunny dates, I would suggest trying for love at first sight if at all possible. A difficult bond can be quite stressful, especially for a first time bunny owner, and a love at first sight bond is less likely to have the risk of a falling out at some later period.

 

[lilnaugrim]

Thanks for chiming in JBun!

I'm happy to hear everyone's experience! Everybunny is different!

Rem (Formerly Wiki but now Remington, I think it suits him better) wasn't so stressed with traveling so I don't think he'd mind much. I'd like to harness train him just to keep him safe when we go out. I've already looked into H harness as well before anyone says anything lol. They're the same ones I use for my cat as well who takes car rides with us occasionally (the older girl won't tolerate it though). So I don't think he'd be too stressed going to a new place. He's settled in pretty quick with me for the most part!

 

[majorv]

I agree with JBun on the myth part. A rabbit's personality CAN change after neuter. There was a poster on here desperate because her sweet lovable male rabbit turned into an aggressive mean rabbit after the neuter. I don't think it happens often, but it's important that advice given here be accurate [emoji6]

 

[lilnaugrim]

I agree with JBun on the myth part. A rabbit's personality CAN change after neuter. There was a poster on here desperate because her sweet lovable male rabbit turned into an aggressive mean rabbit after the neuter. I don't think it happens often, but it's important that advice given here be accurate [emoji6]

This kind of thing happens on most forums, I'm rather accustomed to it so I don't mind. I deal with Betta fish and there are so many myths and truths about them, it can be difficult for new people to see what is what. But I don't take to heart everything that is said here, I always cross reference with a few other articles and whatnot to make sure I'm getting the best information. It's a shame that more people don't do that.

 

[RavenousDragon]

I've never personally seen a male get more aggressive post neuter, but it can happen. The most common behavioral change in my experience is that females become more handle-able post spay (of course, this is not true of every bun I've seen OR of every bun in general)- but I have seen a few females get meaner (if I had to guess it's like 1 in 1,000 and this is not based on a study, just my own personal experience in vet hospitals etc.).

One thing that DOES change in the males is that their urine doesn't smell so horrid post neuter (it can take a couple months, but man to those intact males STINK ). My bunnies live in the bedroom with me and for about a month after my male got neutered (he also wasn't potty trained at the time- which he picked up very quickly!) I dreaded going in the bedroom.

 

[lilnaugrim]

Good to know!

Rem does stink pretty bad but he is litter trained! He has the occasional poop outside his cage but he's pretty good about going only in his cage which is awesome.

Definitely getting him fixed as soon as I can though ^_^
Thanks friends!