Breeding & Pedigrees Still confused..

[Cutebunny]

First I just want to say how helpful and nice everyone here is! It's a breath of fresh air from some other online forums I've been too! So, Thanks

Ok..I have done a lot of reading and I mean a lot, and still haven't really found the answers I'm looking for. Here we go:

I have 2 lionheads (everyone, myself included, agrees). They did not come with pedigrees, do not have tattoos, did not come from a breeder (just a nice old couple who couldn't keep them). So they became a part of our family and I decided to breed them. Breeding was successful and now she has 5 beautiful kits!

1) Is it possible to sell the kits as purebred with a pedigree? (I think the answer is no)

2) Will I ever be able to? Or do I need 2 adults that come with papers and start from there?

3) This 3rd generation thing....Will the grandchildren of my Doe qualify for papers?

4) Where do you get the actual pedigree papers from to fill out?

The last thing I want to do is this, incorrectly. I don't want to end up being one of those people who misleads people. I'd like to get this right. So I need help! Thanks!

 

[pamnock]

Cutebunny wrote:

1) Is it possible to sell the kits as purebred with a pedigree? (I think the answer is no) Do you mean "without" a pedigree? I would just advertise them as Lionheads rather than add the word "purebred" since you don't have pedigrees.

2) Will I ever be able to? Or do I need 2 adults that come with papers and start from there? Generally, a rabbit is considered "purebred" when it has a 3 generation pedigree of rabbits that are all the same breed.

3) This 3rd generation thing....Will the grandchildren of my Doe qualify for papers? Your doe + 3 generations (her kits, grandkits and great-grand kits). Pedigrees must include up to at least the great-grand bunns to be considered "purebred" or for registration for accepted ARBA breeds.

4) Where do you get the actual pedigree papers from to fill out? Blank pedigress can be purchased from ARBA, computer generated, handwrittenor many sites like this one have blank pedigrees you can print out: http://www12.brinkster.com/sara1982/HHHL/HHHLops_KoolStuff.htm

 

[Cutebunny]

Ok so, my Doe's great grand bunnies can be considered "purebred" and then I can hand out pedigrees with them. Even though my Doe didn't come with a pedigree herself. Right?

Also, I read that it's ok to breed a buck with his kit but NOT ok to breed sister and brother. This still sounds like incest to me. But what do I know :?:? Would you recommend this? Or does this cause health problems? Thanks in advance.

 

[pamnock]

Cutebunny wrote:

Ok so, my Doe's great grand bunnies can be considered "purebred" and then I can hand out pedigrees with them. Even though my Doe didn't come with a pedigree herself. Right? In cases of ARBA registration when a rabbit is not the same breed, you would need to breed one more generation so that rabbit is off the pedigree. In your case, your doe meets the breed's working standard, and can appear on the 3 generation pedigree even though she is not pedigreed herself.

Also, I read that it's ok to breed a buck with his kit but NOT ok to breed sister and brother. This still sounds like incest to me. But what do I know :?:? Would you recommend this? Or does this cause health problems? Thanks in advance. Basically, the more you inbreed, the more likely you will breed two rabbits from that family together that have the same genes (the more you inbreed, the smaller the gene pool.) Some of these genes are desired, some are not. You are more likely to see incidences of undesirable genes the more closely inbred (such as siblings) and the rabbits are also more likely to suffer general "inbreeding depression".A common type of inbreeding, called "linebreeding" is breeding dam/son or sire/daughter. This is more likely used with two outstanding individuals or 2 related rabbits carrying the same desired characteristics.

 

[Cutebunny]

Thank you very much for your help and patience! I learned a lot! I love this forum!

 

[crazymandolinist]

My turn! Say I breed a Lionhead buck and doe together and get a litter, then I breed the same ones again and get another litter, then breed bunnies from the first litter to the second litter. Is this still considered inbreeding? And what kinds of genes will develop using this method?

 

[Cutebunny]

Holy crap! I wish I could help you! But this is so above my understanding. Please let me know if you find the answer.

 

[crazymandolinist]

I was asking the judge.

 

[DeniseJP]

Good luck with your new kits and bunnies - I am looking forward to starting the show season myself.

Denise

 

[clevername]

crazymandolinist wrote:

My turn! Say I breed a Lionhead buck and doe together and get a litter, then I breed the same ones again and get another litter, then breed bunnies from the first litter to the second litter. Is this still considered inbreeding? And what kinds of genes will develop using this method?

You'd still be breeding full siblings there, they'd just be different ages.

 

[TinysMom]

crazymandolinist wrote:

I was asking the judge.

In this forum - everyone is allowed to answer the questions. It helps if they have experience with the question being asked....but Pam is very very busy and isn't always able to answer the questions while others oftentimes know the answer and will see the questison first.

 

[pamnock]

TinysMom wrote:

crazymandolinist wrote:

I was asking the judge.

In this forum - everyone is allowed to answer the questions. It helps if they have experience with the question being asked....but Pam is very very busy and isn't always able to answer the questions while others oftentimes know the answer and will see the questison first.

Thanks Peg You're right, I often can't get to all the posts. I just got back from a show in Maryland, so wasn't here to answer the question that was answered well by someone else.

Pam

 

[pamnock]

I have some linebreeding info on my site that you may find useful.

http://www.geocities.com/pamnock/LineBreedingChart.html



Pam