Bonded Pair But Having Issues - HELP!

[BerkleeAjax]

I'm pretty new to all this but need a little help. I have two 15 week old bunnies. A female dwarf lionhead and a male dwarf lionhead/lop mix. They bonded at about 7 weeks just fine and have loved each other since. They were both fixed about four weeks ago and everything seemed to go fine. But I’ve been noticing (or at least it seems to me) that my female is getting smaller, losing weight (?) and isn’t as spunky as she once was. It’s so hard to tell because she does hop around a little bit, still grooms herself and seems to eat. One of the things that I noticed though was that the male (AFTER getting fixed) seems to try and mount her a lot and she isn’t thrilled with it. She allows it, but… When I’ve tried to give them celery leaves or other things as a treat they like, she puts her nose up. He eats like crazy. She just seems OFF and last night I was beginning to think that maybe it was the male and he was terrorizing her.

I decided last night to have my daughter her bring the female back into the bedroom she lived in before the male appeared and where her hutch used to be and see if she’d hop around more. She seemed to like that room. Sure enough she hopped around and curiously explored all over and seemed herself. I had my daughter put her in the little hutch by herself in her bedroom overnight to give the female a break from the male. She actually ate and ate and ate, ate all the celery leaves and other treats we left and stayed at her food bowl for a long time. She seemed so much happier. This morning when she came out she ran and binkied all over the room. She was herself again. Not so the male. While in their condo by himself last night he didn’t touch the food, or the hay. Nothin. He was bummed without the female.

As soon as we put the male and female on the floor to hop around together, he ran all over trying to mount her and she tried to hide from him. What the heck? He’s fixed!! Shouldn’t that get better, not worse? It’s not like they hate each other. They still clean each other, lie next to each other, but there is just something going on I’m not figure out that is making the female unhappy.

I hate seeing the little female unhappy around him and she needs to eat a little more. But won’t eat as much around him. What to do? They are such sweet bunnies, they love people. The female loves to cuddle and chatters her little teeth she’s so happy. The male will cuddle occasionally, but licks my face like crazy every time I pick him up.

Now what? I want my buns happy.

 

[JBun]

If your male has been pestering her this whole time since their spay/neuter, it's not surprising she is losing weight having to continually try and keep clear of him or risk being mounted. It can take up to 8 weeks for the hormones to completely fade, and they can even seem to surge a bit towards the end. So it's not unusual that he is still bothering her in that way. But even after hormones have completely faded, there will always be some humping, as it is a dominance behavior with rabbits, but it shouldn't be excessive. If it continues to be excessive past 8 weeks post neuter, you may want to have a chat with your vet and ensure that both testicles were in fact removed.

In the meantime it might be good to either completely separate them and rebond later, or at least give her some time away from him to get her share of eating in and some free time without him pestering her. Since this seems to upset him, you will also need to keep an eye on his eating, as it is bad for a rabbit to go very long without eating and can lead to serious health problems occurring. Also start monitoring her weight, and make sure she is starting to put weight back on.

If you don't want to separate them and rebond later, then I would at least give her several breaks from him during the day, in fact as much as will possibly work, and still keep him eating. She needs time alone where she can eat and rest in peace. But the best thing would be separating and rebonding later. Though this does carry a risk that rebonding may not be successful. But if you do separate, since it seems to upset him, it will probably work the best to have them in adjacent pens so that they can still see each other and touch noses through the bars. This will hopefully keep your male from getting too upset so he will continue eating fine.

 

[BerkleeAjax]

Thanks JBun. I appreciate the insight. I’m not sure I want to completely separate them and then rebond them, but for now I will try and separate her from him at night so she can eat and get a break. It’s only been about 3 weeks since he was neutered so perhaps that’s part of it and it’ll improve. He isn’t on her constantly, but way more than he used to be. I don’t know what caused it. So frustrating!

 

[JBun]

Even though he may not have been displaying much hormonal behavior before his neuter, after getting neutered it isn't uncommon for there to be a surge of residual hormones. That is why he is now displaying this increased hormonal behavior. The remaining hormones are working their way out of his system. It should gradually subside over the next several weeks. 3 weeks post neuter isn't enough time for the hormones to have faded completely, but this is usually about the time when they do start to decrease. So hopefully you will start noticing less humping from him over the next week or two.

Just make sure if you do separate them for the night, that he isn't going the whole night without eating or drinking, or you could possibly end up with a bun in GI stasis.

 

[Liung]

As JBun said, hormones linger after a spay or neuter for quite a while. They should be separated after a surgery anyway, so you don't risk them aggravating each other and opening the incision. I think my vet recommends that they be separated for a month after surgery? Something like that.

As also mentioned, humping is a normal behaviour even in fixed rabbits. It's how they determine dominance and establish hierarchy. If his hormones are gone and there's no mating drive, humping means he doesn't feel secure in his dominance. You have to let him hump, because until he feels secure, he won't stop. Don't stop him unless he's doing it excessively, or he's face-mounting. Generally, when dominance is being established, the humping will also be accompanied by frequent requests for grooming. You can help this along by staying close by, and when he requests grooming from her, reach over and start petting him. It might encourage her to join you, and it will help him feel more secure (because it's him feeling like he isn't being acknowledged as dominant that is making him feel insecure).

When Lahi was undergoing antibiotics, they really messed with his appetite and I had to give him lots of food to keep his weight on. However, Delilah is a little piggy and hogs all the food, and trying to give them more food meant that she just got fat. Lahi is a slower eater, while Delilah will eat all food put in front of her until it's gone. When I tried to keep them separate, though, Lahi became depressed and stopped eating altogether! It was quite the problem. So, what I would do is put Lahi in his own cage overnight, when I gave them food, and he would have all night to eat it all, and then let him out in the morning when I got out of bed, and they could spend the day together.

I suggest you also do the typical bonding tactics. The big impediment to bonding is bad feelings, and you want your buns to associate each other with good things. If she is being harassed, you really want to prevent her from associating him exclusively with stress and dislike. Even if you decide to separate them completely until the hormones are completely gone, you can do bonding tactics.

For you, since food hogging isn't a problem, I would suggest feeding them together. Eating is a social activity, and the good feelings from eating can be associated with each other. So if you're separating them at night, and she will only eat after a period of separation, but he will only eat after a period together, then feed them twice a day: half in the morning, for her, and half at night, for him. As long as you make sure they don't fight over the bowl, it'll be good. If you want to separate them completely, feed them on opposite sides of a barrier: if they're in different rooms/parts of a room, put the food bowls next to each other on either side of a baby gate or similar structure, so they can see each other while they eat.

Take some dirty litter from the two litter boxes and put it in the opposite litter, to keep them used to each other's smells in their territory. When Picca and Lahi were getting fixed, I had two identical guinea pig cages, and I just switched every day. Later, when Delilah was spayed, I would reserve dirty litter from her litter and Lahi's litter while cleaning them to put in the other one. I would also use the clean shavings from the main part of Delilah's cage to refill Lahi's litter. If one cage/litter gets the smell of one of them exclusively, they may decide that it is their territory alone and become possessive over it.

And of course, the ever-effective car ride. Hands down the best way to artificially induce cuddling.