Second round of antibiotics...

[Pipp]

Haley wrote:

Coccidia is caused by an intestinal parasite, whereas CD is an in balance in the bacteria in the gut (usually caused by too many carbs in the diet).

Heres a great article http://www.bio.miami.edu/hare/poop.html

:yeahthat

The antibiotics can also set off the bacterial imbalance,though. My vets say to give my bunnies probiotics (acidophilus), although I'm not sure they did any good.

Coccidia are commonly found in rabbits, but only rarely cause problems. Sometimes it'sa diet-related Intermittent Soft Stool problemand not Coccidia, but the parasites arepresent so the vet treats it with antibiotics,and I can't help but think that can make it worse.onder: In your case, he needed the antibiotics regardless, though, so that'snot really an issue.

It's always a tough call. Best just to keep them drinking a ton and eating as much hay as possible no matter what he's got. I'm not sure any pellets should be given at this point,but that's a tough call, too. Some ISS bunnies react badly to pellets, some to veggies. If it was simply diet-related, it's just a matter of experimenting. Even a few pellets seemed to make Pipp's Cecal Dysbiosisworse, butCritical Care and veggies made it better.Every bunny is different.

Just really keep an eye on his fecal output. If his poops start getting small and hard, he's going to need to get preventative treatment for stasis, diet-wise, in addition to the gut stimulant.

You can try some pumpkin regardless, and I think maybe a bit of Nutri-Cal if he goes awhile without eating his cecotropes. As previously noted, Critical Care is good for nutrients as well as fiber,it may be something to try regardless if nothing else seems towork.

I'll be keeping aneye on this thread, hope he gets over it soon.



sas

 

[chinmom]

I tried pumpkin last night...I offered him some,but as soon as he touched it, he flipped out and started wiping his face off really quickly, so I figured that was a no-go. This morning he appeared to be re-ingesting his cecotropes, so that's a plus, and he didn't have any little stinky messes on his butt for me to clean up either. He also smelled a lot better

I have been giving him about 1/8 cup of pellets every night, as well as fresh hay constantly.I get the antibiotics all ready and thengive him a treat (freeze-dried apple...his favorite!)before I burrito him. Tonight I mixed his meds with a little pedialyte and baby food (organic fruit) before I gave it to him. I pull it up in a syringe and then put it in the back of his mouth and slowly feed it to him. I only give him a few drops at a time, and then let him close his mouth and swallow, and just kept doing that. Then I gave him pedialyte to rinse the taste out of his mouth.

I tasted that med last night...:yuck:yuckeven after I mixed it with various things it was still gross. I tried banana, strawberry,oranges, apple...EVERYTHING. The baby food was the only thing that killed the taste a little.

I'm starting to think that introducing the greens gave the bacteria the perfect way to multiply, thus causing the problem.Is it possible that his system can't process fresh greens?

I know all about Critical Care and Nutrical. I have both in my chinchilla emergency kit, well actually, I guess it's my chinchilla/bunny emergency kit.

Thanks for the help every bunny it's great to have somewhere to turn to with all my questions!!

 

[Haley]

Youre a great bunny mom! We're happy to help and Im so glad he is looking better (and youre having some success getting him to take the meds).

It is possible that hes just sensitive to fresh greens. I would probably stay away from them just to be safe. Heres hoping he's on his way back to normalcy!

Keep us posted :hug2:

 

[Pipp]

Yup, a lot of bunnies are sensitive to greens -- some to all greens, others to just some greens.

When in doubt, stick to hay and water for a few days or even a week,then introduce pellets for awhile, and if all is well, then veggies,one at a time.When the ISS kicks in,start backtracking.

And for people suspecting it's the pellets, start withtheveggies and then introduce the pellets.

Bunnies don't need pellets if they eat a LOT of veggies, and they don't need veggies if they eat pellets. They are healthiest when they mostlyeat hay. Pellets do provide some nutrients lost when living indoors, Vitamin D I think, but I do believe sun-dred hay provides it, as doesjust a very small amount of pellets, but I'd like to double check that before going on the record. :?

And my bunnies didn't like pumpkin right off the bat, either, but they love the stuff now. Ifound thatit had to sit in the bowl awhile before they'd eat it. With Pipp, I had to dry it off in a papertowel and warm it up a bit. (What a diva!):disgust:

It sounds like you havea great handle on furry critter care,just some tweaks and you'll be a bunny specialist in no time!

sas

 

[chinmom]

Pipp wrote:

And my bunnies didn't like pumpkin right off the bat, either, but they love the stuff now. Ifound thatit had to sit in the bowl awhile before they'd eat it. With Pipp, I had to dry it off in a papertowel and warm it up a bit. (What a diva!) :disgust:

It sounds like you havea great handle on furry critter care,just some tweaks and you'll be a bunny specialist in no time!

sas

LOL, dry off wet pumpkin?? How's that work for ya?? you should just hit up an organic grocery store and buy a pumpkin and slice it then freeze it.

Is there a better type of food as opposed to some of the stuff you'd get at a pet store? With the chins, you should order a high-quality feed that isn't available at most pet stores. What is the best type of food to feed? And I mean the best of the best feed...I don't care what the price is...I keep all my animals on ONLY the best stuff that I can possibly get.

And Georgie is even better this morning!! He actually came out to cuddle with me a little bit!!

 

[naturestee]

That's great! I'm so glad he's starting to feel better.

Unfortunately there's not a whole lot of choice in rabbit pellets,although there are a few really good brands out there. How old is he? If he's still growing, he'll need to be eating alfalfa pellets. I really don't like most pet store alfalfa pellets except the one made by Oxbow. Sometimes you can find that in pet stores but not always. The other good ones are usually found at feed stores. Go for something with 15-16% protein and at least 18% fiber. Pet store alfalfa pellets often have too much protein and not enough fiber, leading to weight gain, heavy shedding, and GI imbalances.

If he's done growing, I prefer timothy-based pellets for adults, which have less protein and more fiber. Or you could choose a maintenance pellet from a feed store that has 15% protein. Ok timothy pellet options are Kaytee Timothy Complete and Martin Little Friend Less Active (not pure timothy, but good nutrition). My hands-down favorite is Oxbow Bunny Basics/T. Again, some pet stores will have it but you might need to order it.

BTW, if you're interested in Oxbow, check their store locator to see if anyone in your area stocks it. Sometimes you can buy it from vets and shelters, not just pet stores.
http://www.oxbowhay.com/index.sp

 

[chinmom]

Thanks for the info, naturestee, and I love your avatar!! It looks like he's saying "thwwwbt" to you and everyone else.I'm SOOOO happy that Georgie is feeling better!! He hasn't been getting any greens at all, and I think it's really helping. I'm going to hold off on giving him anything like that for a while and see if he's fine without it. If his sticky poo situation comes back then I'll know that it's bacterial-based, and if it doesn't, then I'll know for sure that it was diet-based and that I'll have to be careful of what I give him to eat.

I've been giving him pieces of freeze-dried apple so that he doesn't completely hate me for shoving meds down his throat. I give my chins an herbal supplement every night, and I gave him a little bit of that this morning and he was SO excited about it!! It had a little oats in it,and animal-safe herbs, and he ate it right out of my hand.

Any other suggestions on what I should be doing for him? I'm going to keep posting updates, but please continue to give me suggestions and advice!!

Thanks for all the help every bunny !!!!

 

[Haley]

Sounds like youre doing a great job! Is he all better now?

 

[chinmom]

Not completely I didn't give him any antibiotics for a night, and the poo situation came back, but not nearly as bad. I'm going to give him antibiotics for a few more days and see how he does. It's possible that the bacteria was just trying tore-establish itself, so I'm not too worried yet.

Other than that, he's a happy bunny! He has a great appetite, and is always begging for a treat when I come in. He flies back and forth in his playpen, but I don't think his brakes work because he always runs into both walls. But he makes me laugh!!




I forgot!! If you ever need to get your bun to take meds, dissolve it in a little pedialyte first, then add a little peach baby food. I gave them to him two nights in a row and he didn't try to kill me with his back feet. It was a success!

 

[Haley]

Glad to hear you found a way to give him the meds! Good work

As for the poops, how long has he been on the baytril? Its been about a week since you posted this..I would think he may need to be on it longer. Do you have enough to go another week or so?

 

[chinmom]

He's not on baytril anymore...he's on metronidazole. He's been on that for 8 days so far. I'm going to continue it for 3 more days and see how he is. My vet is really great about giving me extras of everything. When Charlie (chinchilla) had his surgery, she gave me extra pain meds and extra antibiotics. I have enough metronidazole to last me about a month.

The dose the vet told me to give was 1/4 of a pill. I've been cutting 1pill into 4 pieces, and then cutting one of those four pieces in half,and giving him that. I wanted to make sure that when I dissolved the pill I didn't lose anything in the whole process (it sticking to the jar or the spoon or in the syringe).

Should I up his dose a little and see if that helps?

 

[Haley]

Sorry I missed your reply! Im not sure about the dose, I have never used metronidazole...

Any improvement?

 

[chinmom]

He's doing a lot better! I did increase his antibiotic dose slightly, and that seemed to do the trick. I did it for five days, and he's been off of it for 2 and everything looks good. No more stinky poo! YAY!!

Thanks for all the help everyone! I really appreciate it!!


Oh yeah...watch for new Georgie pics soon!

 

[Haley]

:hug:Great news!