Need Some Help with Rabbit-Decision

[Nes]

When I set up my rabbitry the bucks will not be in the living room. I will probably set up an insulated shed in the backyard or if we buy a home with a barn (My favourite idea!) I'll just take up one stall. We may have a house-rabbit or two but I can't deal with the spraying of the bucks. I won't be buying any other rabbits until we are well set up, it could be 3 or 4 years from now; and Brad's promised me I can invest in some REALLY nice does when I do .

The real issue is that brad's looking for an excuse to get ride of some of my pets (if he had his way the cats would be going too), and I understand his point. He's an animal person but he's not half as insane as I am; and unfortunatly for my pets when it comes to choosing between giving up the man I'm going to marry and them... the pets have to go . He's giving up smoking for me, it only seems far that I scale back.

I LOVE MY GIRLS!!! Even though they are not cuddly & they are better behaved when they are not pregnant. Since I can no longer expect to sell show rabbits from them (breeder won't give up the pedigrees...) there is no reason for me to keep them unspayed.

It has been suggested to me that I spay the girls before they give birth. Now that is a hard decision and I don't know that I could do that.

I'm putting up some signs for Abi in our neighbourhood, and giving the next owner an option of spaying him. When I gave away my last litter I found some of the babies AMAZING homes (with an previous owner who had just lost her rabbit, or with a family) and I'm only giving abi away to someone that will give him proper love and care.

I don't know how to explain any better that even if i's only going to cost $40 to have abi fixed, that's $40 we don't have right now. I have a horse and they are VERY expensive to keep, that $40 need to go to getting her vaccinated which is overdue.

Abi's not mine to keep either way, I gave him to brad and he's brad's bunny .

Nes.

 

[naturestee]

I think you need to step back and re-evaluate your finances and your ability to care for your animals. Have you talked to a vet at all about payment plans? Many are willing to work with you, especially in cases like this. This is especially important because you don't think you can afford a $40 vet bill. What would happen if one of the buns is injured or sick? What if one of your girls has a stuck kit when she gives birth? This is something you need to set up now so you don't regret it later.

I also think that some vets might be more willing to help you with emergency spays of your girls to prevent more baby rabbits from coming into a home that can't afford to care for them and can't even separate them properly. You might find that a bit repellent, but weigh it against your so-far inability to guarantee good life-long homes for them. The fact that you've taken them to kill-shelters and petstores says a lot. Those of us who have rescued rabbits or volunteer with rescues and shelters have had our hearts broken by what happens to the unlucky "living toys." Have you considered the possibility that your upcoming baby rabbits might live through that kind of hell?

Also what you need to do is sit down and have a heart-to-heart with your boyfriend. You're basing a lot of your hopes on a future that isn't secure. How will you buy a house when you can't afford a small vet bill? What will be changing between now and then? Are there parts of your budget that you can currently cut down on for the animals? For example, do you really need to go to the movies or the bar as much? You need to hash out a budget that will allow you to be responsible for the animals that you have. And if you don't think you can work them into your current budget, what about adding a part-time job? And what will happen in the future if you have your house, have your rabbitry, and you fall on hard luck? What then? You need to decide how you're going to handle this now. At some point you have to decide whether or not you're going to be responsible for the animals that are in your care. And if you frequently have to resort to taking animals to shelters and petstores then I highly, highly recommend that you not get any more.

 

[SOOOSKA]

Wow, I'm getting more upset the more I read. I usually don't reply to these messages, but I had to on this one.

I have two male bunnies that have never sprayed, I guess i've been lucky. One's the most lovable and the other lets us pet him every now & then, he has his girlfriend to be with, but even if he didn't I certainly would NEVER give any one of my pets away. I'd give the boyfriend/husband away first.

I think everyone on this forum has been bitten at one time or another, but it certainly doesn't mean you give your pets up.

My husband and I will do without a small luxury if one of the bunnies need something including a visit to our very expensive excellent vet.

Naturestee you made some very good points.


Soooska

 

[bbgrl20]

I work at an animal hospital, and there is one thing that just gets under all of the employee skins, and that is people not preparing for emergency care of their animal. All of us there have money on the side so we will be able to ensure ours pets will always be able to get the best care possible. I work during night time emergency hours and nothing breaks your heart more than seeing clients take their pets home when it is obvious they need addition medical treatment just because they dont have the funds and are unprepared.

Nes: take the advice from naturestee, take with the hospital manager, they can more and likely work some payment plan for you, if not for now, maybe for later if something unfortunate were to happen.

 

[Bunman]

Financial Help for Vet Bills:

http://messageboards.ivillage.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=iv-ptshojai&msg=858.1&ctx=0

 

[Nes]

I don't even understand how to straighten this out any more...

I've never taken an animal to a kill shelter. The only rabbits I've ever surrendered to the Ottawa Humane Society were two bucks my old roomate left to die at our last place. I couldn't keep them as they were unfixed and didn't have room/money for them so they were placed in good homes. One of them bite my boyfriend tottaly unprovoked so perhaps he needed to be put down, but I didn't tell them that so he's in a good home.

I orignally asked only if there was any reason for keeping my does for breeding now that I can't have their pedigrees. That answer is no so I considered keeping Abi and giving my girls away instead. Abi is still not mine to keep, he is my boyfriend's rabbit and he's decided it would be best to give abi a new home.

Abi wouldn't just cost us $40 for a vet bill, he would cost us for a seperate cage from the girls, he would cost us for getting him another friend (he's not getting along with the girls as he hits sexual maturity as has been seperated for a week now) to keep him company. Yes my boyfriend and I are in financial trouble, he needs surgery we have to save up for. We've been stretching everything and I'm not going to get a second job just so I can keep 1 rabbit. I love abi, but that doesn't make any sense.

I've been speaking with a new owner, a single mother with two girls who is looking for a rabbit - I think they would make great owners for abi. It would be selfish to keep him when he could go to such a great home that really wants a rabbit.

My morals prevent me from killing the unborn kits so although it has been suggested I will not spay my girls before they give birth. I am certain I can find the babies good homes & I'm still not sure they are even pregnant. Spaying my girls is not an emergency expense, it's something I plan to do on my own time, or maybe I never will. That's my decision to make. I understand the benefits and risks of getting them spayed, and will make the decision to do it when I feel like it.

When I did give my other 2 kits to a pet store I bothered to check it out first and as they only adopt out their animals they would be given good homes. Otherwise I wouldn't have given them to them! They would have gone to the humane society! But I knew the pet store had a smaller stock then the humane society right now & either way they work closely so if the pet store couldn't place them they would have gone to the humane society.

I have asked my vet about payment plans they don't do it. We don't even need it, we just don't need so many pets. We I bought my rabbits I was at college and they were my house-pets, I bought 2 cats to keep my older cat company in her last days and I never intended to have a dog but it happened. I'm really tired of being call "irresponsible" because I save 2 rabbits and a dog and her puppies from death by dehydration in a house that was filled with poo. If you guys really feel that saving them was cruel then next time you're welcome to come with your gun.

Now if anyone wants to help ME I'd appreciate you reading MY posts carefully, instead of getting yourselves all rilled up over what you're each saying. I've got nothing more to stay on the subject. Cagney & Lacy are remaining with me, Abi is going to a new home because that is what is best for all my rabbits.

Nes.

 

[MyBabyBunnies]

The people here are just trying to help, they just get frustrated because they care for animals a lot.

I agree with naturestee, if you can't afford a $40 vet bill, you should have any animals at all. I have $900 set aside just for vet bills and I've already used $200 for Zoey's spay and an emergency vet visit. That being said, I'm not currently working and I did not get any of this money from my family. That is also taking in account that I need money for University in the fall, this is money I will not touch unless the rabbits need it.

Sorry but that's the hard truth, pets are part of the fmaily and deserve proper care and a responsible owner should have the means to pay for vet bills before they need to scrape it together in a rush.

 

[Pipp]

SOOOSKA wrote:

... I certainly would NEVER give any one of my pets away. I'd give the boyfriend/husband away first.

Nes has a nifty way of spinning the issues, I'm sure there's a shady politician out there that can use her services.

I think that'Brad' is the one who recognizes the real problem,Nes's inability to care for these animals:

Nes wrote:

The real issue is that brad's looking for an excuse to get ride of some of my pets (if he had his way the cats would be going too), and I understand his point. He's an animal person but he's not half as insane as I am...

Without mincing words, Nes's short history on this board has been a trainwreck. The devastation and the flat-out carnage left in her wake has beenphysically sickening. (Oh wait... my apologies, none of it has been her fault. :rollseyes: Trust her on this).

I truly believe her intentions are good and she's acaring, well-meaningperson. I bet thata lot of the people on this board who are doing absolutely everything right today have 'Nes' episodes in their pasts. I know I sure do.I have many regrets from when I was her age.

But whatever the excuses, whatever the circumstances,the keywordsare'careless' if not'irresponsible'. She didn't take the proper steps to make sure the bunnies didn't get pregnant (on mulitple occasions), or to get them proper homes before they got pregnant,andshe still can't afford their care. She probably shouldn't have the horse, the rabbits ORthe cats. She has to take the proper steps NOW.

Unfortunately, the shelters are all full (thanks mostly to the other 'Nes's' out there), and as previously noted, even if homes are found for her little one-person population explosion, that's just taking a home away from a shelter bunny that will die as a result.

The buck has to stop here. The girls have to be spayed NOW, the boy has to be neutered. Before any more are born.And NO MORE PETS,at least until there's a few grand in the bank.

She can't possibly ensure the safetyand thefuture breedings ofany of these litters. It is GUARANTEED thatdown the line, probably the first generation, but definitely the next, thatoffspringwillbe abused, fed to snakes, neglected and/orset loose to run terrified and parasite-ridden in some park. Andsome will breed, probably under the same circumstances. The cycle will continue.

Thisisn't about the boyfriend.

 

[Haley]

Best.Post.Ever^^^^^

 

[MyBabyBunnies]

Well said Pipp!:highfive:

 

[Nes]

At least I tried to do something about it; and you're all so vendictive and pigheaded you're not even willing to offer some real help. Who here has offered to adopt Abi?

I am taking the proper steps to take care of my pets now. Too many animals were placed under my care by an actually irresponsible owner, and reducing that number is the only thing left for me to do.

Giving Cagney & Lacy away to good homes would pay for my cat's spay, but apparently that's cruel, it's better my cat be impregnated by her brother? and then I would get to keep my cuddly babies? Giving Cagney & Lacy away may be the hardest thing I ever have to do, but if it gave them and my cats a healthier existence that wouldn't be better?

It's better I had left those male bunnies out to die in that house? Or let them go outside? Then have them placed in a rabbit specific shelter that had the resources to fix them?

At least I asked for help, that's all I did. I never asked for people to agree with my decisions, they are mine to make - not yours. So I do thank the few people that have helped me.

Nes.

 

[bbgrl20]

Mybabybunnies wrote: "Well said Pipp!:highfive:"


!!:great::yeahthat

 

[MyBabyBunnies]

No, it would have been better to deal with the cat problem before getting rabbits. Or deal with the rabbit problem before getting more cats.

As for not being helpful, I think we all agree that the animals should ALL be surrendered to non-kill shelters or rescues for all their sakes and BEFORE the does kindle because if they have a complication with the birth, you wont be able to afford the carethey could need.

And the last thing I'd like to address is that I do not think there is anyone in your area that has room to adopt another rabbit, expecially one that is pregnant because they would then they would have to try to rehome all the babies that they did not want in the first place.

 

[naturestee]

If you were actually interested in our advice, I'd cut you more slack. But all I've heard is excuses as to why things have not been and can not be done. Have you even called a shelter yet to ask about spay/neuter programs for your cats? How many times has that been suggested now? Yes, I understand the money issue. Work with it. We can't fix your problems for you.

It really seems to me that you're not looking for advice as much as you are looking for sympathy. Unfortanately, we've run out in your case.

 

[Nes]

BECAUSE I HAVE REPEATED A MILLION TIMES that I have been looking for a spay/neuter solution to my cat problem - and a HUGE Thank you to whom ever posted that link above that is EXACTLEY what I needed.

The issue is that no one reads my posts carefully - you scan them, read what other people wrote then just start typeing.

I have looked for rabbit shelters that will take the pregnant does, the only one I have had time to considered (Haviva) was full but I will keep looking. I don't want to give up Cagney and Lacy but if it ment both them and the kits were going to be fixed I would do it and just live with my own pain. Cagney & Lacy wen't fixed when I got them because they were suppsoed to be breeding does - but that didn't work out.

I would NEVER adopt cagney and lacy to a person who didn't have extensive rabbit knowledge and resources to keep her kits, I wouldn't dream of it.

Nes.

 

[MyBabyBunnies]

I'm sorry we have not told you what you want to hear but we are not here to keep the owners happy. We are here to act as advocated for the rabbits and suggest what's best for the rabbit, not the owner.

 

[NZminilops]

But aren't they already in that situation? You failed to even be able to sex a rabbit and possibly have two pregnant does because of it. I am not that knowledgable on rabbits but I managed to acturately sex 11 kits from two different litters at 2 weeks old so it can't be that tricky.

I am not bagging on you at all, but really if you couldn't even tell that abi was a male how are you gonna do with your rabbitry later on?
Nes wrote:

I would NEVER adopt cagney and lacy to a person who didn't have extensive rabbit knowledge and resources to keep her kits, I wouldn't dream of it.

Nes.

 

[Nes]

Hey don't get me wrong on that one! I think I'm an idiot for not sexing abi wrong too. I wish I could have taken picture but up until this weekend his penis looked like a vagina. It was a little longer then normal but it was round & he had no testicles at all. I don't know how to expain it - they grew overnight. It happens sometimes, there are animals that are very good at hiding it.

The rest of the bunnies I got right, I don't know he was just being sneaky; and I checked him a dozen times as his behaviour started to change, I even checked him THOROUGHLY before the weekend and he was a girl!

Nes.

 

[Nes]

I'm being mature and not being antogonistic so I retract my comments. I think everyone else should agree to let this go by. You don't agree with my methods of keeping my animals, that's fine you have your ideas I have mine. Now can we get on to some people that actually have questions?

Mine was answered awhile ago.

nes.

 

[Bramble Briar86]

minilops wrote:

But aren't they already in that situation? You failed to even be able to sex a rabbit and possibly have two pregnant does because of it. I am not that knowledgable on rabbits but I managed to acturately sex 11 kits from two different litters at 2 weeks old so it can't be that tricky.

I am not bagging on you at all, but really if you couldn't even tell that abi was a male how are you gonna do with your rabbitry later on?
Nes wrote:

I would NEVER adopt cagney and lacy to a person who didn't have extensive rabbit knowledge and resources to keep her kits, I wouldn't dream of it.

Nes.

Some bucks have a split penis and it is hard to tell them from a doe until much later.

Ellie