Mini lop with headtilt

[maitiger]

Hi All,

My bun has been living with headtilt for several months now and on baytril + panacur. He is now on metacam and critical as well. He's been a happy bun for all these months but within the last week his symptoms got worse. He stopped eating, sleeps alot and his poop is quite large (log-shaped, moist). He started getting better, eating more and drinking. Then one day he got worse. He won't move now. He just lays there and shifts occasionally whenever he poops/pees. The vet has told me several times to put him down. I've done research online about Zithromax and Ivermectin. I've also sent articles to my vet, but he still refuses to provide either of the medication. He is a rabbit savvy vet with a good reputation. He says ivermectin will harden bun's kidneys, but I think if ivermectin will give him another good year or two then I would want the option. He still refuses and suggests ear surgery. Him and two other vets at the same hospital suggest to continue the baytril and panacur OR to put bun down. I'm feeling very sad seeing bun like this. He's had 9 good years with me, but I want to know if I've done every thing I could. I've pushed with my vet but to no avail. I live in Vancouver, BC if any one has a rabbit savvy vet I could go to for a 2nd opinion.

 

[JBun]

Has it been determined if the head tilt is due to e. cuniculi or an ear infection? Has a blood titer been done to check for the EC, or xrays to check for an infection in the inner ear?

Ivermectin is not an effective med against e. cuniculi for a few reasons. First of all is how it acts on parasites so doesn't work on the EC protozoa , and also the fact that it doesn't pass a rabbits blood brain barrier, so can't get to any EC spores that may be there. One med that may be helpful is ponzuril. There isn't a lot of info on it's use, but there is some evidence it may be helpful against EC.
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Neurology/cuniculi/pyrimethamine.htm
http://www.bio.miami.edu/hare/paresis.html

For ear infections baytril can sometimes work, but often proves not to be very effective and stronger antibiotics may be needed. Zithromax has seemed to help many buns with severe ear infections, but it can also have negative side effects and can cause a loss of appetite. Chloramphenicol and Bicillin(injections only) are other antibiotics that may be much more effective than baytril. But if your bun is getting worse, and an ear infection is the cause, it would be definitely be advisable to try a different antibiotic.
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Neurology/Otit/otitis.htm

If would suggest finding a different vet. Nothing more frustrating than a vet that won't listen to your concerns.
http://www.rabbitsonline.net/f28/finding-vet-13366/
http://rabbit.org/vet-listings/

 

[JBun]

Looking at the vet lists in your area, these seem like they may be the best choices.

Dr. Martinez
http://littlepawsvet.com/

Dr. Prus
http://kinggeorgevet.com/

And if Watermelons still recommends this vet. Hopefully she'll be along to say if this or the other vets are good choices, or if there is another she would recommend.
Dr. Briggs
http://austinanimalhospital.com/

 

[Watermelons]

I would still recommend Dr Briggs, but depending where in Vancouver you are, Coquitlam may be a bit of a stretch. Other vets do occasionally work at that clinic, so its important you ensure you book and appointment with her. (same goes for any clinic actually, make sure you deal with the expert, the locum may not be rabbit savvy) We've been dealing with my 2.5 year old rat and her permanent heat tilt lately, I thought the last time I brought her in, that would be it, but Dr Briggs had us try some different stuff and that little rat is still going!
Definitely bring your research and ask for a copy of the file from your previous vet (they may not give it directly too you, but they have to fax it to the new vet requesting the info) It will be nice for any new vet to see what you're willing to try, what you have all ready tried, etc etc.
What types of tests have you done to determine what is actually happening?

 

[maitiger]

Hi,

Thanks for the replies Jbun and Watermelons... there haven't been testing. My vet is a well known rabbit vet from Eagle Ridge Animal Hospital. He has told me testing is not always positive and clear, so he never gave me that option until I did my research and asked. He still said testing won't help. He could only suggest ear surgery for bun. Dr. Briggs is actually 2 mins away from where I live, she is well known to treat rabbits too?

Does any one know if there are alot of bad and good days with head tilt? Prior to Monday, bun was happy, eating, and giving me kisses...then I wake up and he could barely move or eat.

 

[Watermelons]

She used to treat a fair amount of bunnys when she worked on Vancouver Island. Purchased Austin Animal Hospital just a few years ago.
She treats a few bunnys now at the clinic, including mine, shes treated all my rats, great with small animals, but refuses to touch my reptiles haha. For those I go to DR Walton in Maple Ridge.

I've honestly had nothing but bad experiences with any type of exotic animal at Eagle Ridge (even dogs and cats). Odd diagnoses, odd treatments, lazy examinations. Used to deal with them a lot when I worked at a pet store that dealt with them and it just urked me. But this is about making sure you get good treatment. Not me complaining about Eagle Ridge lol.

Testing can be quite expensive and yes sometimes inconclusive. But it really depends. Head tilts can be caused by a number of things, so with out testing its not always possible to find out the cause with out testing. Or you can just continue to toss random meds at the animal in hopes one of them works.
Since you've tried some meds all ready (knowing what the dosage was and the length of treatment may help) you may know what it wasn't and now other possibilities of what it could be. However if the meds were done/dosed incorrectly then it could still be that other issue those meds were for.

 

[maitiger]

Jbun, thanks for your help and insight. I'm learning alot about different options and it's hard to filter the side effects/effectiveness of them all. I'll bring up with my vet tomorrow morning (altho I know what he will say)...if the night goes well.

Watermelons, that's good to hear. I went to Eagle Ridge because the dr was on the rabbit savvy list of vets around my area. He first had head tilt in June 2013 and his condition got better. It returned in September and he's been on baytril + panacur ever since. I'm a little frustrated because baytril wasn't working to improve his condition but it seemed to keep his head tilt at bay as in it did not progress any further. He went into GI stasis a couple of weeks ago due to being on baytril for so long (I did use bene bac to counter balance this). The stasis seemed to worsen his condition...headtilt cranked to the right...I then gave him critical care and metacam which seemed to make him happy again and he started eating independently, being his regular self. Saying hello and good bye to me. I will call Dr. Briggs tomorrow to see if she has suggestions to improve his condition...I'm hoping he will improve...

UPDATE: he is currently declining FAST. He would only eat greens in the morning - parsley, romaine lettuce. My Fiance saw him later in the morning around 11-2pm and he ate a bit more but did not want water. I came home at 3pm and he would not eat or drink. I syringe fed him water and critical care - he took it. He is wasting away. So I was advised to syringe feed him approx every 4hrs. 11pm feeding - he will not take the syringe. 2am - try again he eats a bit, but gives up. He will not chew and most of the food dribbles out. I am very worried and sad. I am thinking if he does not get better through out the night I will have to consider letting him cross that rainbow bridge. I am SO heartbroken. I can only say I've learned alot for my future bunnies.

~taking work off tomorrow to spend the night with him. Thanks for the support. I hope the morning will be better.

 

[JBun]

I hope your bun made it through the night ok. If you can, I would suggest calling Dr. Briggs up today and asking for an emergency appt. It sounds like your bun is in an extremely critical state at this point.

 

[Devi]

If your willing to travel to Vancouver island there is a very good one at Van Isle Veterinary Hospital in Courtney.

 

[MustNotBuyMore]

Really sounding like torticollis (wry neck) to me, which can be cause by several things. I would put the rabbit down and end his suffering, honestly. I'm afraid testing at this point probably won't do much. I'm sorry!

 

[lovelops]

If your bun makes it through the nite I would try to get testing done and see about another doctor. I had an animal recover from being paralyzed after two months. If I had jumped the gun and had him put down, I would have never seen him recover and walk again. I would never rule anything out unless I had testing done because without it, anything is conjecture.
Without having results in your hand, you have nothing positive to go off of. That is like going in and having a doctor say they are going to do surgery on you without first doing Xrays (which is what the drs did with my mom...) to see the problem area... having all the information possible is key to obtaining a true solution.

I pray that you bun improves and since you want to spend more time with him and love him dearly, I hope you find a positive solution to his problem.

Vanessa

 

[MustNotBuyMore]

How is he doing today?

 

[maitiger]

Hi everybunny,

I called in to my regular vet and dr. briggs both couldn't schedule him in until the next day. He was very weak. I stayed up with him until 4am. Got up again at 7:50am to check on him & said good morning. He took his last breaths and said good bye at 8am. I am very heartbroken. I miss him dearly. He was a very sweet and special boy. I'm been grieving and don't think I'll ever stop missing him. It was a good 9 years. I wish I had more time with him. Thanks for all the feedback, I'll keep this in mind for the future when I'm ready to adopt again.

Rest In Peace Pudgee.

 

[lovelops]

Oh my goodness. What a great photo. What an angel. I'm so sorry to hear that he's passed and that the doctor wasn't able to see him in time. I wish I could say something to you to make you feel better but know that I can't. After the death's of some of my other pets not that long ago, I was quite inconsolable so I understand how you are feeling right now. I honestly wish that they could have done something to have saved him and I'm very sad to hear of your loss.

You are in my thoughts..

Vanessa

 

[Crystalkate]

😢 I am so sorry for your loss.

 

[pani]

Binky free, Pudgee. ray: