Greens & Quantity

[Pipp]

Spinach is high in oxalates so my Mikey can't have it, but I have yet to have a bunny react badly to kale. Keep in mind that veggies (and even hay) grown from field to field may have different content, it's very hard to determine and micro-manage.

Kale is not usually that high in oxalates, but there is a big difference between types of kale. I don't have a problem with the green curly kale but the russian red or black kale can cause problems for all my rabbits if they get a lot of it.

The calcium danger is really overstated, the rabbits need calcium for teeth and bones. It rarely causes problems.

As noted elsewhere, I'm having trouble finding out the difference between oxalate and calcium intake when it comes to crystals as opposed to stones. Mike had blood in his urine and high crystal content, no sludge or stones, and his bladder problems have been directly related to his spinach intake. (I also limit chard, mustard greens and collard greens).

Here's a pic of Pipp's salad again... They really should eat a large variety of veggies. A little of almost everything (except legumes, leeks, some roots, etc) is best. I try for at least one leafy green, one herb, one cabbage-like veggie (broccoli, brussel sprouts, cabbage) and one different colored one (bell peppers, raddiccio, cauliflower, sometimes tomato, whatever).

PS: Pipp has to have kale, it seems to be the only veggie that keeps her molar spurs in check. Little diva won't eat hay.


sas :bunnydance:

 

[Thumperina]

The list that I've compiled, the things that are high in oxalic acid are:
parsley, spinach, mustard greens, beet greens, swiss chard, kale, raddish tops, sprouts(1-6 days after sprouting, that have a high level)

according to rabbit.org, kale is not high in OA. Here is the list
http://www.rabbit.org/care/veggies.html

Parsley
Spinach
Mustard greens
Beet greens
Swiss chard
Radish tops
Sprouts



I don't know which is true.

 

[Thumperina]

so strange for me to hear that silantro and parsley are veggies. To me, they are all herbs (but of course, it doesn't matter)

 

[Pipp]

It's just not very black and white. EG: I do believe English parsley is higher in calcium than Italian, etc.. (And I just read somewhere that strawberries are high in oxalates, go figure, LOL!)

Every area tested will have different results because it depends on soil, climate, fertilizer, you name it.

If the rabbit stays hydrated, though, it's not an issue. Mikey is a rare case so for most, it's not a concern.


sas :bunnydance:

 

[Pipp]

PS: I'm also concerned about carrot tops being too high for Mikey, I think they're on the high end of the scale for oxalates, but again, for almost everybun else, not an issue. Best weapon is giving small amounts of a lot of different veggies, can't go wrong with that.

 

[Imbrium]

When people say to limit the kale or mustard greens or other calcium high greens how much limiting are we talking about? The way they stress it some places you'd think you feed your rabbit some spinach and its going to immediately have some sludge!

with high calcium greens, I've heard from vets (like Geoff, who hangs around here) that the connection between calcium in the diet and calcium-related health problems is dubious at best... so I'd say for a rabbit with no calcium problems, you really don't need to limit much (except possibly carrot tops, which have like 10x the calcium of other high calcium veggies).

with high OA veggies (fwiw, I've found other sources that say kale is even though rabbit.org doesn't list it), HRS indicates that they can be fed daily *but* they need to be rotated (basically, the same one shouldn't be fed more than 2-3 days a week) and should only be one of three veggies fed. since they recommend 1c+ of leafy greens per 2 lbs body weight per day, that would mean a limit of 1/3c high OA veggies per 2 lbs body weight per day.

 

[Thumperina]

hmm, I usually feed more than 3 varities of veggies a day. Should it be 3 only and why?
I can give at the same day: kale (not much), romane, collards, broccoli (not much), carrots (a little), endive, silantro (maybe not all together but certainly more than 3 varieties). I do try to rotate though

 

[Thumperina]

Do veggies nicely stay in the plate, Pipp? I always was wondering how other people serve veggies as mine would have them all around the serving site. This is the solution that works best for us so far (don't pay attention that there are carrot and that much broccoli - the picture was taken long ago when I didn't know so much about feeding them right, I had 6 rabbits back then) :

 

[Imbrium]

hmm, I usually feed more than 3 varities of veggies a day. Should it be 3 only and why?
I can give at the same day: kale (not much), romane, collards, broccoli (not much), carrots (a little), endive, silantro (maybe not all together but certainly more than 3 varieties). I do try to rotate though

more than three is just fine - the main point is that there should be variety, so three is more of a minimum

 

[Thumperina]

do you guys chop large leafy veggies ? I find it better not to, as large leaf is heavier which allows it to stay where it is without moving when buns are eating.

 

[Imbrium]

it depends... sometimes I tear stuff up into smaller pieces if it's really large to fit it in the colander better, other times I skip the colander and just hold the greens in my hands to wash them and give the big leaves. I find that the bunnies are happy to inhale their veggies either way.

 

[Nancy McClelland]

Ours get Romaine, Dandelions, Cilantro, Parsley, Italian Parsley, carrot, celery, and a small piece of apple daily. Some get more volume and some we give less to (messy poops) and our run from 3 to 19 pounds so, size does matter.

 

[ldoerr]

I do not tear apart big leaves. The only time that they get leaves that are not normal sized is when I buy a salad mix for them. In those cases the leaves are chopped up to make it easier for humans to eat. Bunnies do not have a problem with big leaves. I actually prefer it that way, less mess.

 

[whitelop]

I used to tear the bigger leaves into big pieces. They fit on the plate better and it allowed me to mix everything together better.

 

[Bunnylova4eva]

Any time I give Ripley more than the ammount of a baby carrot, he leaves cecals all over the place and it is quite the mess. Taffy seems to be able to tolerate more, but I really don't give many greens per day.

I find this interesting how you all give so many. Our vet is very rabbit savvy and recommends only giving the size of their ears in greens per day. That's always worked wonderfully for our bunnies but then you all give so many, I find such varrying oppinions on it interesting.

 

[whitelop]

My vet is an ARBA judge and pretty well known in the rabbit world and when I told him how many greens Foo got per day, he was very impressed. She got between 4 and 6 cups.
Not to say your vet is wrong, because everyone has differing opinions. This probably came out a little more rude than it should have, lol.

 

[BinkyBunny]

I never cut anything up for Charlie. If something needs to be removed from the veg then I will cut it for that reason. If its a giant leaf, then Charlie gets a giant leaf tossed to him. He does well and the mess is much less tan if I cut it up. I do admit I have trouble measuring if I don't cut up so I wonder about that. It's hard to say, "hmm yes that leaf is a cut..."

 

[Imbrium]

the size of their ears? that's so little! mine LOVE their veggies, I'd never get a moment's peace if I tried to cut them back to such a small amount.