Emaciated & hunching Bun

[Sealy]

My mother bought a little Fuzzy Lop at the pet store (the one I have been trying to get investigated,& also the little bun that was sick there that I was so worried about) I was very upset when my mom brought this Bun home ( she brought 2 home actually) because it was 1. an impulse buy and 2. I already have one of her Buns that she decided she just didn't have time to take care of.
I can't control what my mother does. But since she lives on the other side of the house, I can keep an eye on the buns. I am supervising her Buns -dogmatically pushing bun education on her and I check on the buns several times a day. Anyway...on to my point ( I do have one!)
This little bun is a Fuzzy Mini Lop I believe, and I would put her age around 12 weeks or so. She was very emaciated when she came here ( has been here 2 weeks now) Always hunched over, never stretches out. Her poops were very tiny and scanty and she was lethargic. She gets poopy bottom ( but hasn't had diarreah ) and usually sits in her own urine (which is red/orange sometimes). She also has mucus staining around her nose and on the inside of her front legs where she has been wiping it but at present, no signs of runny nose or eyes ; also, no malloclussion)
My mother took her to the vet ( we don't have any especially bun savvy vets here, the closest I have to one is my own vet for my dogs, who knows more than the other vets around here and sees lots of buns) My mom didn't tell him all of the symptoms so, I can't blame him ( yet) if he missed something with the bun. He did diagnose her with Coccidia and sent her home with antibiotics ( TMS) and said to continue to give unlimited food & hay and some green veggies.
She has improved, picked up a little weight, eats and drinks well, in fact she gobbles up all foods ( hay, pellets, veggies). Her poops are looking so much better, but she still gets poopy butt and has orangish urine and sits in it. She also is still always hunched over. I haven't noticed any teeth grinding though - is it possible that she had a fractured back and it healed that way? ( she isn't paralyized though) She is less lethargic, now moving around more and trying to 'play' but it's still a delicate situation.
Now, my questions... does it sound like there is more going on with her than coccidia? I feel like she needs to go back to the vet, but what exactly do I ask him? I know to tell him the symptoms, but what if he says she is just malnourished and just needs to get healthy? I need to know where to go from there if that happens ( which may be entirely possible) I have read all I can get my eyes on ( searches here, medi-rabbit; HRS stuff; etc etc) but my lack of experience has left me overwhelmed with all that info.
Im sorry this was so long, if you have any suggestions, I would greatly appreciate them! Thanks for your time


~ Sealy =)

 

[aurora369]

It sounds like this poor little bunny has a weaken immune system and has had a hard go at life for the first little bit.

The snot stains on her nose and paws is a sign of some sort of infection. To best medicate, a test on the bacteria in her nose should be taken to determine which anti-biotic will work best.

I would also try to get lots of fluids into the bun. Dark orange/red urine is a sign of a dehydrated bun. Syringe her some pedialyte or water down juice. Anything to get some good healthy fluids in her.

Also, what kind of pellets and hay is she getting? For a bun that needs to pack on some weight, I would offer some alfafa hay and a good quality high protien pellet (around 16% protien would be good).

You can also get her de-wormed in case she has a parasite that is not allowing her to absorb the nutrients properly. I'm not sure on what meds work best for that, so hopefully someone else will chime in.

Sitting hunched could be because of gas. You can try giving her some gas meds with simithecone in it.

She should visit the vets, but I would focus on the runny nose and try to get that dealt with properly.

--Dawn

 

[Sealy]

Thanks Dawn.
Penelope is on Oxbow Bunny Basics/T for pellets & a combo of Oxbow Alfalfa hay & Timothy Hay. And she is eating well, especially the hay.
She is also drinking well, her crock ( medium sized) twice a day at least.
I did think of giving her simithecone drops, but since she is so sickly, I wasn't sure if they would be harmful to her if it wasn't gas & without consulting the vet first, I have been wary of it. Will the drops hurt her as a preventative?
If it wouldn't be harmful if gas isn't her problem, then I can certainly give her some.
I called my vet's office a bit ago and talked to the vet tech... I told her of all the other symptoms - when I told her about the colored urine, she said that it was normal- that's the color of their urine. :? I said, yes, in some rabbits, but also could be a sign of dehydration or food changes or an illness etc. ( that is right isn't it? lol - I've done so much research all of the illnesses and diseases are running together)
But I'm taking her in tomorrow @ noon for a follow up visit.
If at all possible, I would liked to be 'armed' with some specific questions and suggestions to give the vet if need be.
Also, is there anything physically I need to do with her before she goes ( clean or not clean the poopy butt, bag a urine sample, etc. ) I'm making a list of things I am seeing or not seeing, her tummy sounds... anything else I need to list?

 

[Sealy]

Thanks Dawn.
Penelope is on Oxbow Bunny Basics/T for pellets & a combo of Oxbow Alfalfa hay & Timothy Hay. And she is eating well, especially the hay.
She is also drinking well, her crock ( medium sized) twice a day at least.
I did think of giving her simithecone drops, but since she is so sickly, I wasn't sure if they would be harmful to her if it wasn't gas & without consulting the vet first, I have been wary of it. Will the drops hurt her as a preventative?
If it wouldn't be harmful if gas isn't her problem, then I can certainly give her some.
I called my vet's office a bit ago and talked to the vet tech... I told her of all the other symptoms - when I told her about the colored urine, she said that it was normal- that's the color of their urine. :? I said, yes, in some rabbits, but also could be a sign of dehydration or food changes or an illness etc. ( that is right isn't it? lol - I've done so much research all of the illnesses and diseases are running together)
But I'm taking her in tomorrow @ noon for a follow up visit.
If at all possible, I would liked to be 'armed' with some specific questions and suggestions to give the vet if need be.
Also, is there anything physically I need to do with her before she goes ( clean or not clean the poopy butt, bag a urine sample, etc. ) I'm making a list of things I am seeing or not seeing, her tummy sounds... anything else I need to list?

 

[Bunnicula]

You may want to read up on pasteurella if you've not already. I know that the snotty nose is a possible manifestation of that...

It's great that you are reading/researching so that you are better armed with info for the vet.

Let us know what happens!

Mary Ellen

 

[aurora369]

The gas medicine should be fine to give even if not needed. The way simithecone works is to help bring the gas bubbles together, making them easier to pass. I would give some just in case it does provide some relief.

The bunny basics T is a timothy based feed that is lower in protein. If possible, I would try getting a hold of a feed designed for growing rabbits. Check feed stores in your area to see if they carry a feed suitable for growing or nursing rabbits. They normally are an alfalfa based pellet and have a protein of about 16%.

As for the vet visit, I would get a culture done of her nose. Find out what exactly is making it run and which antibiotic will be the best suited to getting rid of the problem. That would be my main concern for this rabbit.

Also ask if they could do some de-worming, in case she's got worms. It shouldn't hurt her and if she does have worms, getting rid of them will allow her to gain weight and grow.

--Dawn

 

[naturestee]

I agree with Dawn. Switch her pellets to a quality alfalfa brand. The timothy pellets are meant for adult rabbits, not growing babies so they won't provide as much energy. Feed stores usually carry better brands then pet stores. The mix of hay is good. You can also give a small amount of Nutri-Cal daily. It's a supplement for cats and dogs that is found in most pet stores. It provides energy and some essential nutrients that can help sickly animals.

Also agree with the bacteria culture from the nose. That way the vet will know exactly what he's dealing with and which antibiotic will work best.

As for the hunching, does she stretch out at all? Does she seem sensitive to being touched on her back at all? Definately ask the vet- he might not notice it because most of his rabbit patients are probably hunched up from stress at the clinic.

 

[Sealy]

Great advice and added to my notes to take with me.
I just checked on her and she is now moving about almost like a healthy bun. She is bright and alert and has put on a little weight.
She is still peeing and pooping and just sitting in it :/ I also noticed little pink dribbles of urine here and there.
I will certainly ask for her to get a nose culture done. It hasn't been running since she has been here... is it possible that it all happened before she came here and could clear up and is still just stained? ( we haven't tried washing that part off yet) I will still ask to get the culture done though to be on the safe side.
I cradled her in my elbow and her back stretched out. I would assume if it was a healed fracture, it would not straighten out. She doesn't seem sensitive when her back is touched. Poor little girl, I suppose I would be all hunched over too if I was that emaciated and weak :/ She is doing some jumping now so I am hoping stretching out will be next. In answer to question: " As for the hunching, does she stretch out at all?" - No, she hasn't as of yet.
I am happy to say that she is eating and drinking like a little piggy now
Oh, would be ok to give her veggies? ( right now I have parsely, cilantro and romaine lettuce on hand) I also have fresh papaya on hand.

If there's anything else, please post, as I will be checking through the night and in the morning before we go.
Thanks bunches!

~ Sealy

 

[aurora369]

Because of all the upheaval and change in her life recently, I would wait a little bit. There are so many things uncertain about her at the moment, I would just stick to pellets and lots of hay.

I would start veggies once she's nice and comfortable. Not sitting hunched all the time. You'll be able to tell if her tummy is gassy or upset better.

When you do start, I would go very slowly.

One idea I just thought of: Was she in a really hot place before your mom got her? It could be possible that her nose was runny from the heat and it is just stain. I would still take her to get tested just in case though.

--Dawn

 

[chinmom]

Has the vet done a blood draw? In chins, hunched back can be a sign of liver problems. I've noticed a lot of similarities between chins and buns in terms of illness and treatments, so I would seriously consider having a CBC and Chem Panel done.

I'll keep the little girl in my thoughts!!

 

[Maureen Las]

Gabriel, my new bunny was very emaciated and dehydrated when I took him and I am still trying to get to the roots of his problems.
I did get his blood drawn and he has some abnormal values..one of them is a high eosiniphil count which could be many things but it could suggest parasites.
Vets diagnose coccidia by doing a test on the poop..Gabriel came back negative but coccidia doesn't always show in the poops because of the life cycle of the parasite/protozoa. it sometimes has to be repeated several times
usually vets give Albon for coccidia ..what did your vet prescribe?
Also if the vet is able.. you should get blood drawn as it tells a lot.

Your bunny is much sicker than gabriel and may have multiple things going on.

I switched Gabriel to alfalfa pellets anfd also give him alfalfa and timothy.
I give Gabriel greens but he seems to handle them OK..if theire is any suggestion of enteritis it might be a good idea to lay off the greens to see if the poopy butt goes away.
It looks like you will have your hands full with this bunny but you can already see him improving which is great.
I am interested in this particularly because of my own new bun who was a mess when I got him.

Good luck with the poor little thing.

 

[pamnock]

Sealy wrote:

Now, my questions... does it sound like there is more going on with her than coccidia?

~ Sealy =)

Keep in mind that coccidia overgrowth are often a "secondary" symptom to another illness. You may have dealt with the cocci overgrowth for the time being, however, the initial cause of illness has not been determined.

Definitely needs further evaluation by the vet.

Pam

 

[Sealy]

My vet had an emergency surgery to do yesterday, so we had to reschedule for Monday. Penelope has just blossomed even since I last posted. She is even more active and actually stretched out!
I ran out of OXbow pellets, so I decided to try the local feed store's. I got the 17%.... actually, my mother went by there....I wanted the 18% but this is what I have for now. Will the 17% be sufficient or should I move on up to the 18%?
I am still keeping my appointment Monday though, I will be asking for the tests to be done, and hopefully we can get her completely straightened out.
Thanks so much y'all and I will update as soon as we return from our vet visit.

~Sealy

 

[undergunfire]

Sealy wrote:

I ran out of OXbow pellets, so I decided to try the local feed store's. I got the 17%.... actually, my mother went by there....I wanted the 18% but this is what I have for now. Will the 17% be sufficient or should I move on up to the 18%?

Did you gradually switch the bunnies over to the new food over a few weeks time, or did you do a sudden change?

If you did a sudden change, then you better give your buns lots of hay and make sure they don't get upset stomachs.

Drastically changing a rabbits food can cause some major problems.

 

[Sealy]

I didn't have the option to gradually change for that long She has only been here two weeks, and I just ran out of my reg. feed yesterday. poor planning on my part I suppose. New shipment won't be here till next week. Although, I did mix what was left in her ( the other's as well) bowls. Caring for her was basically thrown in my lap, so I'm having to make adjustments on short notice.
I was concerned about the sudden food change...hopefully all will be ok.

~Sealy

 

[Sealy]

Poor little Penelope gave her fight to live up yesterday around noon. She seemed to have been doing better Sat. night and even early Sun morning. Somewhere between 10:30 a.m. & noon though, she gave up. Bless her little heart. I'm glad she isn't suffering anymore but I was really hoping she could pull through it all.
I really don't have much more to say right now, it is the first bun death I have experienced and it has left me in a funk .
Thanks to all those of you who gave advice.

~ Sealy

 

[naturestee]

I'm so sorry. Poor little baby, she had just gone through too much. At least you gave her a few happy days. Binky free, Penelope.

 

[undergunfire]

I am so sorry for your loss of Penelope :cry2.



Binky free, sweet Penelope :rainbow::rabbithop.

 

[chinmom]

I'm so sorry for your loss...but at least she knew she was loved!!

Binky free sweet Penelope...