Dental disease in an older rabbit

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I agree that he shouldn't have buprenex tonight. You don't want to put a rabbit with respiratory problems into respiratory failure by giving him a lot of buprenex. It probably will be worth a second opinion if you can do that tomorrow. I am worried that he might be in a lot of stress and pain tonight. He probably should be getting a stronger antibiotic and not having the wound packing. The second vet can also double check the dosage on the pain meds (especially the buprenex). Good luck to you guys. I'll be thinking of you.
 
He seems a little more alert this morning (probably because he didn't get the buprenex) but still having trouble breathing. I work at an animal hospital, so I'm going to bring him with me and give him some oxygen while I wait for a vet to come in. The animal hospital I want to take him to opens at 8 30.. so I will try to get him in for an emergency visit ASAP this morning.

I just heated his disk back up and I'm going to try to feed him. I know he must be in pain... I'm going to give him the metacam this morning, but no buprenex or fluids until a vet sees him.

I'm worried it can't just be a side effect of the buprenex if he's still having trouble breathing. He last got it at 9:30am yesterday.. it's been almost 24 hours.
 
So I took him into work at 7:30 this morning. I kept him on Oxygen for an hour until a doctor came in and I took an xray. The doctors don't see many rabbits and weren't sure about the heart size in the xray, so to be safe they gave him an injection of Lasix before I drove to the other vet.

By the time I got to the other vet he was gasping. I got inside and he was panicking, probably because he couldn't breathe. They took him right back and I thought he was going to die right there. He was barely breathing, he was in terrible shape. They put him on Oxygen, found a vein and gave him an injection of Dopram. This started him up breathing again. The doctor looked at the xrays and didn't see any fluid in the lungs or around the heart, so she thought the breathing difficulty was due to a severe URI. His temp was 104 and they had to give him an injection of antibiotics.

They put in an IV catheter and started him on fluids and gave him other supportive care, moved him to an O2 tank and ran some bloodwork.

I then got a call about an hour later saying that he went into cardiac arrest and they couldn't revive him.

The doctor told me that there was dark, tarry stool on the thermometer. His kidney values were elevated and he was very anemic. This all makes me furious because I feel that these signs could have been noticed at his regular vet on Sunday when I took him in. They never asked to run bloodwork and I didn't see them take the temperature. Maybe if they had thoroughly examined him on Sunday we would have been able to start treatment before he got to this point.

I really liked the vet I saw today and I plan to take my other rabbit to her for care in the future. I just wish I'd found her before Pete had his issues. Maybe he would have recovered.

I appreciate everyone's help throughout this whole ordeal.
 
Poor guy. Buprenex can cause respiratory depression, but I wouldn't expect it to last that long after not giving him the drug. I know in humans if an opiod overdose is suspected (leading to respiratory depression) they can administer nalmefene (trade name Narcan) to reverse its effects. I don't know if they do this to animals. The main use of the Narcan is in acute opiod overdose by people that abuse opiods, so it probably isn't commonly used in veterinary medicine. I assume you could use it off-label with dosing guidelines that were set forth in the original safety and/or efficacy pre-clinical studies done by the drug company, but that would require a lot of research to uncover those studies, and they may not have initially tested it in rabbits (although it's likely).

Also important to note is that buprenorphine (buprenex) is metabolized by CYP3A4, meaning that there's a specific enzyme in the liver called cytochrome P450 3A4 isoform that breaks it down. Some other drugs can inhibit CYP3A4. Metacam is not one of them, but you may want to check with the vet or read the labels of any other medications he's on to make sure they're not CYP3A4 inhibitors. If CYP3A4 is inhibited, the levels in his system could be too high.

As bad as this sounds, it's better for it to be a buprenorphine overdose than some other cause of respiratory depression. It could be due to swelling or another abscess causing airway constriction that he's not getting enough O2. I really hope the O2 treatment will turn him around and the vet can figure out what's causing this.

Huge hugs and positive thoughts sent your way. I'm really pulling for him to make it through this.
 
I'm so sorry you lost him. What a shame that such a well-loved and cared-for bunny had to pass on. I'm thinking of you and Toot today. [hugs]
 
I'm so sorry. Binky free, Pete. :rainbow:

With the high fever, I wonder if the abscesses might have spread or caused a systemic infection. Since they were already in his mouth, it wouldn't be surprising if they had spread to his nasal cavity, causing difficulty in breathing.

Whatever you do, don't question your actions too hard. I think you did a great job taking care of him and you are obviously trained in medical care for small critters. The fact of thematter isPete was an olderrabbit with who-knows-what in his past whodeveloped severe health problems. There are always what-ifs and they can drive you crazy.

:hug:
 
I am really sorry about Pete, but to be honest , I felt that this mighthave been the outcome from the first post.
he was sicker than even diagnosed which means that there was probably little that could have helped him at that stage.

I , agree that the first vet should have done more but it's doubrful that there would have been a different outcome for him.

it is a terrible ordeal for you ..
and then you lost him

;however he was an older guy and had a wonderful life with you

Biny free little Pete :nerves1:cry1:
 
Thanks everyone. I know that the outcome looked bad from the start, I just hope that by discussing my concerns with his previous vet that they will consider this case when they deal with bunnies in the future, and hopefully that will lead to advances in their care.

Poor Toot was hiding alone under a table that she never goes under today. I think she's going to miss having her buddy around. I really miss Pete and haven't really fully accepted this whole situation yet. I'm hoping that some time in the future we can adopt another needy rabbit and give him a good life, and hopefully give Toot a loving companion. I feel that would honor Pete and give us a way to pass on the joy that he brought us. It's amazing what an impact he had on us in the short time we had him.
 
Was Toot able to see his body after he was gone. ?

That's helps a lot with a grieving companion so he isn't waiting for him.

There are so many bunnies in rescues that have had no life at all. It would be wonderful for you to give another a chance ..and also a companion for Toot
'Hugs"

Maureen
 
Take blanket or something that smells like Peteand give it to Toots. it might help.
I have always brought the dead bunny home so the companion know that his buddy is gone
if you didn't bring Petehome take a blanket or something and rub it on a stuffed bunny and you can give him a stuffed companion for the time being . Sounds pathetic (it really is pathetic) but I have a few bunnies that groom stuffed animals.
 
We did bury Pete at home so I showed Toot beforehand so she'd understand what happened. I expected indifference considering the fact that she didn't seem so concerned when he was sick and didn't interact much with him at that point. Instead, she was leaning over the edge of the box sniffing him. She seemed concerned. And I think she understood that he was gone.

My boyfriend and I talked about it and we decided we would offer to foster a rabbit for the House Rabbit Network (They helped us to place the rabbit who was surrendered to us along with Pete.) I know that I want another rabbit in the future, and I want Toot to have a companion, however I feel that we're not ready to adopt yet. I think that fostering may make me feel a little better, helping another rabbit who needs it, and give both of us an opportunity to consider another rabbit in the house.
 
That's good--both of those things. Best of luck. You'll know when it's time to look for another buddy for Toot.
 
So today I picked up my new foster bunny, Jimmy.. I figured I'd share some pictures. He's the sweetest thing. We've only had him for a few hours, but he's already so comfortable here. I hope he finds a great home soon, he deserves it.

JimmyRes.jpg


Jimmyres2.jpg


Jimmyres3.jpg
 
AHH too cute. I would just want to hold and pet him all day long!
 

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