Abscess and fly strike

[Thumperina]

I don't know how it all happened so quickly.
She had urine scald last summer, but it was gone and she was fine during cool season. Thumperina is a large 9 lbs girl with a lot of fur . She is 4 yo
Now it's getting hot...She lives in the yard, taken inside for a night. . Yesterday I saw that she was trying to clean her privates and she was uncomfortable. Touched her butt - my hand was in blood. She had blood all over her butt and back legs. It was in the evening, so I washed her bottom and saw them... white worms, a lot of them. I had to wait till the morning to take her to the vet, today is Saturday.
The vet I wanted wasn't there so his collegue saw us. She said Thumperina has an abscess, a hole in her body, a deep pocket filled with fly eggs or whatever they are called. A good thing, she said, is that her urinary tract seemed intact.
they removed what they could and gave her one time med that was supposed to help kill those inside. I am given oral AB and pain med to give her at home. She has a large dewlap, giving medicine isn;'t easy at all.
She was all right, eating and moving, before I took her to doc. Now she is stressed of course from everything that we did, plus she is brought indoors which is unusual for her.
Several months ago I was told here on the forum to stop using cedar shavings for litter and I did, now using aspen shavings. Do you think she will process her AB OK?
Anyway, this is our sad situation... I am praying that she pulls thru.

 

[mightyscotto]

I am really sorry to hear about Thumperina. I will say plenty of prayers for her that she makes it through. I really hope the medicine works and that she gets better soon

 

[Blue eyes]

Oh Bummer! Flystrike isn't pretty. Will pray she pulls through. Poor girl. :sad:

 

[Thumperina]

thank you all.
I can only say that she seems to have good appetite and she is alert.

A question... if those maggots (fly larva) crawl off her in the house... are they dangerous to anybody else? I have young kids and cockatiel birds

 

[Thumperina]

I wonder about the root problem. Something got her bleeding and having a wound in her privates. Any ideas? I was checking her butt but I guess not enough often.

 

[Aki]

No, it's not dangerous for your kids or bird especially since the vet should have pulled out all the maggots. It's just flies, after all...
The root problem might very well be the flies themselves. Flies laying eggs close to the rabbit's private is a relatively frequent occurrence for outside rabbits when the weather is hot and the maggots will burrow themselves into the skin looking for a moist hot place. The eggs hatch in 24-48h and the maggots can eat the tissues until the reach the bones and kill the rabbit with toxins. It can go downhill very quickly.
Flies are particularly attracted to overweight bunnies (often, clean themselves a bit less thoroughly), long-haired bunnies, bunnies who have urinary infections or soft stools problems, wounds, abscesses... anything a bit dirty and moist will do (yeah, flies are disgusting)
It's possible your rabbit had an abscesses before the flies came. In that case, I would say an untreated wound who got infected. Just a little scratch can become nasty very quickly and if the maggots got into it, well...
Antibiotics, anti-inflammatory and a topical treatment like Nolvasan Otic (the vet probably shaved the area, didn't he?) are standard treatment.
If the rabbit is alert and eating, I'd say you probably caught it on time and your odds are pretty good.
In the future, it might be advisable to take a quick look at your rabbits' bum everyday when it's hot outside as 24h is enough for the nasty creatures to appear (isn't that scary? no wonder insects will outlive us all...)

 

[Thumperina]

thanks Aki
She said she removed what she could but she said more are in the tissue and she didn;t feel right digging into the tissue.

She DIDN"T prescribed any topical treatment - even though I asked! According to her, there were not much more she could do. Should I go see another vet (the one who I usually see and who was off this Sat) to ask again about topical treatment? I don't feel good that I have to wait for 2 days...
She said she sprayed the area with something and she gave her internally something, but I don't see those meds in the bill. Strange, isn't it?

Finally I saw Thumperina's stool. Not shaped, kinda small, and connected into a string. It's hard to watch poop when you have several rabbits housed together. I will definitely check my other buns for maggots.

The stuff prescribed is
sulfa/trimethoprim - AB
meloxidyl - pain med

Are they good meds?

 

[Thumperina]

how long do they stay larva?

 

[Azerane]

I'm very sorry to hear about this, fly strike is an awful thing. If you do go back to the vet, they should definitely remove the maggots that are inside the tissue, it may require local anesthetic, but they can't be left in there. If they haven't already I also recommend getting the fur off her rear end shaved down. This will make it easier to check for maggots, and also less attractive to more flies. There doesn't need to be a wound for fly strike to happen. Just a warm, damp place, perhaps a little bit of urine, or a tiny bit of stuck on poop is all it takes for a fly to want to lay its eggs there.

It may vary depending on species, but from what I'm reading, eggs hatch in about a day, the larvae are active for 3-4 days and then pupate for 3-5 days before becoming flies.

I'm not sure if it would help, but you could also try giving one of the rabbit safe topical treatments for fleas/ticks etc. And definitely give your other rabbits a thorough check as well. Once Thumperina has the all clear from the fly strike, you'll need to let her wounds heal completely before letting her outside again, otherwise it will simply attract flies again.

 

[Thumperina]

thank you friends
I just transferred her to the (finished of course) basement where she will be more comfortable (she was in my bedroom first)
She fought me rather bad when I was trying to remove her from under my bed.
I took a look on her privates. Didn't see any maggots but the skin definitely looks swollen and rotten. I am cautious to put anything on her skin that wasn;'t prescribed fearing to make it worse. I asked the vet when I was there if she would give her anything for the skin, she told NO. Lots of vets don't like when a patient insists, they think they know better (well, reasonable)
I see her pooping, poop still not the best but it;s poop. I don't see her peeing. Litterbox seems to be clean and no spills of urine around. Can she not be peeing at all?

I checked my other rabbits. FooFoo is a small rabbit who cleans herself very well without problems. She is fine. Polly is overweight and has a problem to clean his butt and I was concerned about him but he didn't have anything that looked bad.

Any proven ways to deter flies in the backyard?

 

[Thumperina]

how about simple triple antibiotic cream??? Neosporin? By the way, she is not bleeding, just looks bad in there.
They shaved her a little, and I certainly won't traumatize her skin by shaving her now. When she fully heals - yes, that I am hoping for.

 

[RavenousDragon]

Did your vet want to do a check up soon? I would wait until then before putting anything on her skin. I would assume the vet would want to see her fairly soon, since it sounds pretty bad.

In terms of keeping the flies out of the back yard, I have no idea how to prevent that, since flies can do just that- fly. It's actually a common problem for outside rabbits. Is there a way to keep them inside?

 

[Thumperina]

The vet wants to see us in 2 weeks only! when medicine course is over.
Again, this was a vet who worked on Sat in the clinic where I take my pets sometimes. I will probably go see another vet but it's all money money money...

About keeping them indoors, first of all, my rabbits LOVE and used to be outdoors... for us, it's rather inconvenient too. I will be bringing them inside for the summer during the day when it's real hot, other than this, no, they will remain outdoors. Of course, Thumperina will stay inside until she heals.

 

[Thumperina]

Thank you everyone for your replies!
There is 2 doctors in that clinic. I used to be seeing a male doctor (and he was rather helpful, I also have birds), never dealt with the lady vet who works there. On Saturday he didn't work, so I had to see her as we had an emergency.
Do you think it's OK to go to the same vet clinic and request a follow-up with the guy? Would it look like I don't trust the lady doctor we saw on Saturday? I think she did a good job cleaning her wounds, but two things worry me - that she wants to see us in 2 weeks only, and that she didn't prescribe anything for the skin. I guess going there on Monday for her to look at the wounds would be totally normal, but what if I go there to see not her but another doctor?
Or should I just go there and ask both of them to look at Thumperina?

 

[Azerane]

2 weeks, wow. I would be way too worried to have to wait two weeks to see a vet after fly strike. I would want a check up much sooner, that being said I've never had to deal with it.

 

[Aki]

I would phone the vet (maybe asking for your normal one if you don't trust the other) explaining that the wound still looks bad and is bleeding and would really ask again if it wouldn't be wise to put a topical treatment to avoid it from getting infected. Your vet probably told you to take away any bedding / litter to avoid it from getting in the wound and to clean daily, keep the rabbit's bum as dry as possible.
Maybe you can pick something at the vet's counter without needing to bring the rabbit for another consultation.
Unfortunately there is not much you can do to avoid flies- they are just everywhere (maybe these disgusting glue paper things?). Keeping an eye of your rabbits to react quickly when the maggots problem occurs is the only thing you can do (it's not that frequent, though, your rabbit just probably had bad timing getting a small wound when flies were around).
Here are two articles about it:
http://rabbit.org/fly-strike/

http://rabbit.org/fly-strike-emergency/

 

[RavenousDragon]

I've worked in veterinary hospitals for many years. You can totally request to see a specific doctor- especially if he normally sees your pets. If the other vet is offended by this, honestly, that's just sad. We have people request certain doctors all the time. Just explain you are worried about the wound and want a vet to check on it again, set up an appointment, and just explain that while you really appreciate how well Dr. So-and-so did with your animal, you are used to Dr. Regular and would love it if you could see him instead.

 

[Thumperina]

I've worked in veterinary hospitals for many years. You can totally request to see a specific doctor- especially if he normally sees your pets. If the other vet is offended by this, honestly, that's just sad. We have people request certain doctors all the time. Just explain you are worried about the wound and want a vet to check on it again, set up an appointment, and just explain that while you really appreciate how well Dr. So-and-so did with your animal, you are used to Dr. Regular and would love it if you could see him instead.

I did all this and he said that sure I can request an appointment as early as today...

Do people usually have a followup visit when they have a serious condition (just to bring in the animal to show the progress) that is free of charge? just to take a look and see if healing is on track? it's like a continuation of the previous care, in my opinion...
You see, he prescribed me topical medicine for skin over the phone when I asked. but now I am in doubt. When she didn't prescribed one, did she have a reason for it?

I would love to come and talk to both of them, having the rabbit with me... I don't want to pay for it as a regular visit. Am I expecting too much?

Thanks RavenousDragon and Aki for your input

 

[Aki]

Honestly, you can always ask to talk to both vets. But if you see the vet who seemed more experienced in rabbits it would already be a good thing. In my experience, they will do a follow up by phone but if you have a new visit, then you pay except if your vet is exceptionally nice. I'm taking Aki to the vet tomorrow after determining myself what the problem was to make the vet run some tests (I made my own list) and I will pay even though I took her 10 days ago and that the vet was unable to find anything wrong with her and completely missed the issue (she has cataract which made it difficult for her to spot the hay and caused GI stasis - the vet examined her and told me she was perfectly fine despite my insistance there was something weird about her).

About why the vet didn't prescribed topical medecine, well... maybe she doesn't know much about rabbits and didn't realize that they almost always need agressive care to get better because they are a lot more fragile than cats or dogs (sometimes in a clinic you have a small animal specialist and a "generalist" but you will see the generalist if you come on the day when the specialist isn't there and they will very seldom have the honesty to tell you). When I went to see the vet last time, I talked to one of the vets and explained that I treated the GI stasis problem myself with Emeprid. The woman looked at me with big eyes saying "but Emeprid won't work, it's to make the animal vomit". Yes, it is. For CATS. But it's been used to help the guts of rabbits to move for years. Besides, rabbits can't vomit. ^^'
When I lived in Paris, I had great rabbit specialists close by. Now that I live in a smaller city, I do a very thorough search before going to the vet trying to come up with a possible diagnostic, tests to be run and meds. That way I can ask for this and that to be checked to confirm my diagnostic and ask for the necessary meds accordingly. That's the only way I found to make sure nothing important was left out. I'll admit it takes a lot of time, that my parents and friends think I'm crazy and that vets don't like me much, but what can you do...

 

[Thumperina]

thanks Aki and everybody who talk with me!
I asked them and they said the cost of reckeck is $30. This office is a little stuck up (but good)
I got cream for her skin. Derma-vet. Another $40
I am so pissed..... just checked online and the cost is only 8.25, while I paid over 4o in their office!!!
Does anyone know if Derma Vet oinment is safe for rabbits???
What can I use to gently clean her skin before applying it?

Do you guys ask to prescribe generic meds?