need help with a rescue bun

[Kristina]

*Sorry just noticed I probably put this in the wrong section*

I'm new here! But not new to buns:biggrin2: (hey Wendy! Saw you are a moderator here I'm a member of the MMHR group on yahoo. I LOVE Sasha! :inlove:Wish had the money to adopt her but extra money goes to the critters as it is ) BUT...I do need help with a recent rescue girl. I got her about 4 days ago. She was living with a pretty dutch buck. Neither are fixed so I can imagine what she's gone through. The cage was filled with about 2 inces of feces and she has urine stains all over her, I assume from the buck spraying. well I have them settled in and seperated for now. Problem is she is a biter. I think this is due to the fact that she was being hit with a stick by the previous owner for nipping What can I do to build her trust and can I help her with her biting issue? The buck is actually a real sweetie and has no problem getting attention. Sooooo...any good advice for this poor girl to make her more comfortable?

 

[naturestee]

Eek! Hit with a stick! ullhair:

First, I'm hoping you're getting her spayed ASAP?

For now, go slow and let her get used to all the changes. Make sure she's in a cage where she can get in and out on her own for playtime, and lure her back in with treats/supper/veggies. Sit- or better yet lay- on the floor and let her approach you if she wants, don't move your hands if she comes near. When she's more settled in and more used to you, start feeding her treats out of your hand. Try doing it through the cage wire first so she can't bite you. With my bridge bunny Sprite, the next step was to put the treats on a small plastic lid and hold that for her to eat off of, since holding the treat directly usually ended in me being bitten. The idea is to teach her that you, and your hands, are not going to harm her and can be quite nice.

If you think she would allow you to pet her (outside of her cage only please), place your hand a few inches in front of her, finger tips down on the floor. I've found that many rabbits see this the same as another rabbit posturing for grooming and will often respond to it even if they've never seen a human do it before. If she pushes her head down and forward towards your hand, then she is allowing you to pet her. Or ordering you.

That's basic intro stuff. There's a bunch of us here who have cared for aggressive rescues. If you can describe how and when she bites you, what you're doing, etc., we might have more specific ideas to help too.

And check out the articles on aggression in the Lagomorph Library:
http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=12319&forum_id=17

Hope that helps!

 

[Kristina]

Yes.....sadly being hit with a stick

I'm going to get her spayed as soon as possible but I am concerned she might be pregnant from living with the buck. Not sure how to handle that situation. :cry2I was aproaching her with my hand in Her cage so that may be one of the problems because once out of her cage she isn't friendly but she is not trying to bite either. This is my first experience with a bun this aggresive....I've had a few doozies but never biters. I'll research the links you provided and keep working with her. She is really beautiful...appears to be a dwarf mix of some type.

 

[pla725]

I have hadagressive males who settled down after being neutered and given plenty of TLC. I also learned to use a top opening cage with the two of them. I learned to announce that I'm putting my handin the cage/pen in a soft voice to give them reassurance. I also moved slowly and carefully.

Spaying will help. Give her time and patience.

 

[bunnybunbunb]

The problem might be is she is pregnant. Not all does get agressive when pregnant but all the hormones can cause them to flip in personality and become agressive. I have a doe that was the sweetest girl and even with her owner before me but she is pregnant now(due in a few days) and since about 2 weeks in she has been grouchy. Today when I was moving the things around in her cage sheleaped forward and started scratching my hand with her front paws. I have never had a rabbit do this but it is better than biting that is forsure.

I find rabbits normally only bite while in their cage. Try moving her cage. Let her come out of her cage on her own then handle her. I have also delt with rabbits with cage agression. They can be very terriorial in their cage but real sweet hearts out of their cage.

One more thing, was they housed inside or outside? I have also had rabbits that lived outside all their lives and when brought inside they got agressive.

 

[naturestee]

I know it might be a hard choice about what to do with a pregnant rabbit. At the Humane Society I volunteer at, they do spay/aborts. If a pregnant animal can safely be spayed, then they will. It's sad, but they're overcrowded as it is and and if more are born, it's more likely that animals that are already there will have to be euthanized to make space for them.

I don't know what your thoughts on abortion are, but either way you should talk to your vet about your options. I'm not sure if all vets will do spay/abort, some might choose not to. Can you handle any emergency vet care that might be necessary if she has trouble during labor? If she's a small dwarf mix, she might be more likely to have complications due to her small size. If the buck is much larger than her it increases the likelihood she'll have problems. Will you be able to care for the babies and adopt them all out? How hard is it to adopt out mixed breed rabbits in your area, and how full are the shelters and rescues that take rabbits in?

 

[Luv-bunniz]

naturestee wrote:

I know it might be a hard choice about what to do with a pregnant rabbit.  At the Humane Society I volunteer at, they do spay/aborts.

I was just going to say about that. When our local ferret rescue (that we help at) got in loads pregnant jills they all got speyed and were fine. Like already said, it is a hard decision. Maybe, talk to the vet about it? s/he will probably know what is best.

and dang...hit with a stick hope you get her sorted soon.

Good luck!

 

[Kristina]

I'll talk to my vet about it today and see what he says, but if I know him he won't want to do a spay/abort. If worse comes to worse I can find great homes for up to 3 for sure. Ahhhh...the frustration!

nature...she is a large dwarf mix (or it appears so) She is not a normal tiny dwarf I also think she is overweight, But the buck is considerably larger than her *sigh* I'm sure the vet would be able to handle any complications should they arise.

bunnyb...they were outside rabbits. When I went to get them there was a thick layer of feces on the floor of their cage. It was VERY nasty.

 

[Marietta]

Kristina, hi and welcome!

First of all, it was a great initiative you took with the poor buns, save them from somebody that was ...hitting the poor girl with a stick!!!

You understand that she's biting out of defence, she must be scared to death of hands, so she's trying to protect herself by biting. You have to be extra patient in order to gain her trust. I believe that after some time, when she'll feel more secure in her new environment and will be able to relax and enjoy the love you'll be giving her, she'll see that she won't need to be defensive any more.

Our member, Flashy, has written an excellent article called "bonding with your bunny", it's in the Library section and you'll find it most useful, in order to get ideas how to best approach your bun and win her heart.

Good luck and keep us updated on her progress (how are you gonna call her?).

Marietta

 

[naturestee]

Hopefully her obesity will have prevented her from getting pregnant. I've been told that overweight girls have a harder time getting pregnant. But with the boy much larger than her, I'd highly recommend spay/abort and push the issue with your vet. If she gets a stuck kit- more likely with the boy beinga lotbigger-she might need an emergency surgery to save her life. One of our other members recently lost a girl whose uterus ruptured due to a stuck kit. It's really scary.

FYI, it can be hard to tell if she's actually pregnant or not since you don't know when/if she conceived, even if a vet or experienced breeder checks. It's your choice but if she were mine she'd be getting spayed ASAP.

 

[gentle giants]

What Naturstee said about feeding her treats through the cage bars is great advice, that is one thing I would do also. My main advice for right now though, is only to handle/disturb her if absolutly necesary. What I do when I get a rescue that has fear agresion, is for about a week or so, longer if needed, I only come close to them for feeding or health care. When I feed, I talk to the rabbit quietly and calmly, even if they try to scratch or bite me. What this girl needs right now is security, so that she can begin to learn that not all humans are cruel. And it may take a long time, I have one doe that I have been working with for almost three years, and she still gets frightened very easily.

I know there are others on here with more experience than I have, this is just whatI have found works for me. My two cents, LOL.And while I would hate to do it, it probably would be the best to get her spayed immediatly, it would jsut add to her problems, and yours, if she were to have a litter now.

 

[Kristina]

Well I talked to the vet. They can't see her till Monday. We discussed her pregnancy concerns. He said he will only do a spay (when pregnant) if he sees eminite (sp?) health problems. Due to the fact that the buck is larger than her it seems like he will be agreeable to spaying either way. I am concerned though. I gave them each fresh hay. The boy starting eating his right away! He loved it. She on the other hand nibbled at it. I left to go tend to the chickens and when I checked on her about two hours later she had moved all the hay to the back corner of the pen and made a nest. I've been watching and she isn't pulling out any hair. What are your opinions? sign of pregnancy/false pregnancy/etc? Oh I also went to the pet shop ealier to get them a few toys and I got some of those wooden carrots....I am happy to say she loves those wooden carrots!

 

[Kristina]

Oh and does anyone have any good bunny "stores" to look at for toys and such?

 

[gentle giants]

Thatprobably doesn't mean much, a lot of does will only start pulling fur when actual labor begins. Labor typically only takes about 20 minutes or less from beginning to end, and she will want privacy for it. If it takes a lot longer, or you can see her straining with no result, then you will want to look at her bottom for any sign of a stuck kit.

 

[Nelson_is_mine]

I'm not really sure about bunnies, but I know that with dogs that if they're a fear biter, then you're not supposed to pull your hand back when they bite it. Though it's a natural reaction, it's actually teaching the dog that by biting, it can can control the situation. Could it be the same with a rabbit? Maybe with a combination of thick leather gloves and treats you can coax the poor girl out of her shell.

 

[TinysMom]

Kristina wrote:

Well I talked to the vet. They can't see her till Monday. We discussed her pregnancy concerns. He said he will only do a spay (when pregnant) if he sees eminite (sp?) health problems. Due to the fact that the buck is larger than her it seems like he will be agreeable to spaying either way. I am concerned though. I gave them each fresh hay. The boy starting eating his right away! He loved it. She on the other hand nibbled at it. I left to go tend to the chickens and when I checked on her about two hours later she had moved all the hay to the back corner of the pen and made a nest. I've been watching and she isn't pulling out any hair. What are your opinions? sign of pregnancy/false pregnancy/etc? Oh I also went to the pet shop ealier to get them a few toys and I got some of those wooden carrots....I am happy to say she loves those wooden carrots!

If she is making a nest - it can be one of two things:

• a false pregnancy - perhaps she was mounted about 2 1/2 - 3 weeks ago and she thinks she's pregnant but she's not....in which case - she'll probably destroy the nest in the next few days to maybe a week
• she really is pregnant - in which case she is due probably in the next week or so - could be sooner - doesn't have to be

I am not a fan of "emergency spays"....but then again - I tend to think (in general) that God creates life and we shouldn't take it......

As close as she is to her due date (if she is pregnant) - I'm not sure if the vet would do a spay or not....and I know you said he's bigger than her - but if he is the same breed....and since it sounds like she's a larger breed (not like a Netherland Dwarf or anything) - I would think the chances are good she'd be ok.

Either way - no matter what you decide though - we're here for you.....

I will say this though...babies can be so much fun....if you think you could find homes for them in another 8-10 weeks....you might want to consider letting her have them.

Just my .02~

Peg

 

[Kristina]

Thanks for the responses everyone....I was able to feel her stomach and it feels firm but I didn't feel anything obviously "babyish". I will wait to see what the vet says next week. Should she be very close to being due I've made the decision not to abort the pregnancy...It's just not in my heart to end those lives. Maybe it's not the ideal decision but I'l keep al the buns for as long as it takes to find them really great homes!

 

[gentle giants]

Good for you, taking the responsibility for any babies that might show up. Although here's keeping my bunnies crossed it's a false pregnancy! :biggrin2:

 

[Kristina]

Thougth I would post an update for the group in case anyone was wondering....Well "Sasha" as she has now been named had a false pregnancy so we got her fixedon Monday. She is doing well with her recovery but she is still SOOOOO angry. Poor girl I don't know if she'll ever get over it. We've made progress though she has started to let me touch her forehead! You can only touch it though...still no petting...she still gets really nervous. Otherwise she is doing fine :biggrin2: The buck that came with her is wonderful!! He is the sweetest bun ever! "Romeo" is his current name. He is scheduled to be fixed May 12th.

 

[gentle giants]

That's great! IN this short a time, even allowing you to touch her at all is incredible progress. I know it took months to get that far with Charity, and she still, after two years, still flinches if you touch her ears. I believe she was probably picked up/carried by them. We are working on "therapy" for that now.