Looking for information: Depression

[TinysMom]

THE BACKSTORY

First of all, I want to say that in the past I have been under adoctor's care for minor to medium depression. I have seen a counselorand dealt with some of the issues that made the depression worse thanit is.

However, I seem to have a depression (I forget the actual term for it)that is cyclical...it comes and it goes and it needs to be monitoredmuch like you would monitor your blood pressure if you had high bloodpressure or your sugar levels if you had diabetes.

In the past I've also been on Paxil. I was on it for over a year andtook it almost every single day at a set time because I found if Ididn't take it - I had a headache. After about 14 months on the drug, Istarted getting worse and actually having thoughts of suicide. I woundup going off Paxil and then talking to my doctor about it the next week(we were out of town and I forgot my Paxil..by the time we returned...Ihad no more headaches and was doing much better...thank God).

Over the last year I have gone back on Paxil (half strength) maybethree times and been on it for a month or so at a time but then goneoff usually because I would forget to take it or my schedule was messedup and I didn't have a good time of day to take it. My biggest problemwith Paxil is that it makes me want to sleep 16 hours per day when Istart on it (for about 2 months).

CURRENTLY

I am finding that I am struggling with depression again. It is not asbad as it used to be - partly because my counselor helped me come upwith a plan of attack for those "bad" days (I allow myself one day inbed...then the next day I MUST get up and do 3 things...the last time abad bout of depression hit - I didn't even take the day in bed as Irealized I didn't really need it and could keep going).

But I recognize that the depression I'm experiencing right now ischemical-related. I need to deal with it....and I know I need somethingto help me out.

THE QUESTIONS:

Art told me a couple of months ago that he had read that St. John'sWort (a particular formulation of it) is as helpful towards treatingminor to moderate depression as Paxil - and without so many sideeffects.

I've gone on the internet to do some research and I find mixed views onthis. Many sites agree (but frequently they are selling the stuff). Anherbalist board I checked out had mixed feelings on this too. Some wereVERY pro St. Johns Wort while others voiced caution.

I am leaning towards trying the St. Johns Wort for a limited period oftime - perhaps a month - before going to see the doctor and discussthis with him.

We're retired military and I don't get to pick my doctor really. Well -I do have a set doctor...but he and I don't exactly mesh well together.I would prefer to not deal with him right now if I don't haveto. (It doesn't help that I am horrid about taking my bloodpressure pills and I haven't been keeping track of my blood pressure -so he will be labeling me "non-compliant" (which I have been) andnoting it in my chart...). If I can take the SJW for a month- that gives me time to get back on my blood pressure meds, take myblood pressure and track it - and appear to be a "goodpatient". (STOP LAUGHING).

So...the questions are:

a. Has anyone here used (or knows someone who used) Paxil and then went to SJW? Or vice versa?

b. Has anyone got links to sites that AREN"T selling SJW but have information on this? (I did try to google it).

c. Does anyone know of any issues with SJW and othermedications? I know we have some on here who deal with hospitals andsuch or chemistry or anything like that...

Please feel free to PM me if you don't want to share publicly on hereabout your experiences or the experiences of someone you know.

I want to make good decision for me. I don't mind paying for the SJWand taking it a week and then saying, "Guess what....I'm having badside effects...I'll just wait 3 weeks and talk to the doctor once Ihave my meds down and my blood pressure recorded for a bit..".

I still have Paxil here and I could go on it. I almost did sotoday...but I just hate the way it puts me to sleep and some other sideeffects.

Peg

 

[maherwoman]

Oh, Hun, that stinks to have that going on and off for so long.

While I don't know much about St. John's Wart, though I have taken itbefore, and while it did help, I found that taking B1 helped MUCHmore. Turns out, my body burns B1 like no tomorrow, whichfrequently causes such problems as you're experiencing. AndI'm not saying this lightly. I've had groups of days where Ihaven't eaten enough, and haven't been able to take my B1 (because youhave to have food in your tummy when you take it, or wow, what astomach ache!!), and have gone into DEEP depression (and we're talkingthe whole shabang to the point of feeling suicidal, sleeping entiredays away, etc.) resulting from not having the B1 in my system.

I would HIGHLY recommend trying out taking 500mgs to start out with,and give it a few days (you'll notice a bit of a change the first day,and more change daily), and balance it out with about 1000mgs of B3(niacinimide/niacin), 5000IU of Vitamin A, 400IU of Vitamin D, 800IU ofVitamin E, 2000mgs of Vitamin C, 500mgs of Magnesium, 25mgs of B6,200mgs of B-Complex, and 100mgs of Pantothenic Acid (B5). Iknow, it sounds like a CRAZY amount of things to take, but the bigtrick on it is getting a good balance on the vitamins because taking somuch of one could off-balance the rest.

I also found a site about Alternative Mental Health (site that givesinformation on how to treat various things going on in thebrain/mentally) that has a lot of GREAT information.

Here's the site:
http://www.alternativementalhealth.com/

Here's the section on the site that has their various articles on Depression:
http://www.alternativementalhealth.com/articles/default.htm#D

And here are a couple articles that may help (all dealing with natural/alternative remedies for depression):
http://exchange.healthwell.com/nutritionsciencenews/NSN_backs/feb_99/depression.cfm?path=ex

http://www.alternativementalhealth.com/articles/seasonal.htm

Now, as I said above, please don't think I'm taking your Depressionlightly, or that I don't know where you're coming from. IVERY MUCH do...I have struggled with it myself for about ten yearsnow. I was on Zoloft for about a year, and decided to stoptaking it one day, because I really didn't like how it was affectingme...so I know what you mean about not wanting to take Paxil.

I hope those sites help...and PLEASE let me know anything andeverything I can do to help, ok? I am totally, 100% here foryou. You have my full support and love. :love

Love and hugs,

Rosie*

 

[TinysMom]

Wow - what great links. I've bookmarked them soI can go back and read them later in more detail. I found myselfreading several articles though - very interesting.

One thing I thought of last night after I'd posted this and gone tobed....is if I were to walk in today to see my counselor again (I amconsidering going to see her again if I can get the referral so ourinsurance will cover it)...is that she would not recognize me from thewoman I was in 2005. In fact, as I started thinking back over the way Iwas then and the way I am now...there is a MAJOR MAJOR difference. I'vecome a long way. I think that coming a long way is part of why I foundmyself asking here about the experience of others...

In 2005, before my first visit with her - I sat down with a piece ofpaper and listed the last 25 years and then in every year - if I had adepressive episode - I marked it down and listed if I knew what causedit (financial problems/having change of life situation like new babiesor something). I figured if I had a depressive episode that lasted morethan 2 weeks...I'd write it down. Imagine my shock when I haddepressive episodes something like 14 or 15 out of 25years.....!!!!!:shock::shock::shock::shock:

I'm thinking that I may go to the store today and buy the vitamins yourecommended and start taking those. I want to make some more changestoo and those might help. Here are some of the things I'm thinking ofto help me out...

a. Try to go for a walk every day (its pouring out right now - so I won't go unless it stops raining).

b. Try to drink some orange juice every day - I know it raises my blood sugar levels and the vitamin C is good for me.

c. Build some more routine into my life. I may not get up atthe same time every day - but I can still do some of the same things...
have my quiet time
take a shower
get dressed
and (GASP) - maybe even put on a tad bit of makeup...for ME!

I find that having the rabbits and having the routine to HAVE to feedthem, etc. often keeps me focused. So I'm thinking if I add a few morethings to my routine....it will help.

d. I think I'm also going to list maybe 5 things I want toget done every day in the house...and then try to do an additional 3 or4 things that I plan in for the day...even if it is simply "kick backand enjoy the house today" or "putter with my figurines" or somethinglike that.

I think the house often adds to my depression but then I get too depressed to work on it to lift the depression.

I may write more later. Thanks to those who PM'd me and to Rosie for posting here. I hope others will chime in too...

Peg

 

[Pet_Bunny]

Hugs Peg. :hug1

Many, many people havedepression. It must be the stress ofeveryday life in todays world. It doeshelp to talk about it.

For St. John's Wort, I think ofit as a herb. In cases of moodchanges, or very mild and temporary set backs itmight help, but for (serious) depressionyou shouldbeunderthecare of aDoctor andwith his advise oftaking some form of antidepressants ortherapy.

Don't mix (take)St. John's Wort and antidepressants together.

For Paxil, you should start ata low dosage over a number ofweeks and build up to a level that youare comfortable with. Anyantidepressant, you are supposetake on a regular basis with nointerruptions (on again/ off again). Ifit doesn't seem effective,the doctor might increase the dosage.Again, it takes time toincrease or decrease the dosage level.
If Paxil doesn't work, thedoctor might have you try another type ofantidepressant.

But don't stop just likethat. It does takes a while (many weeks)to get off antidepressants,as the doctor will guide you overtimereducing the dosage.

Rainbows! :groupparty:

 

[maherwoman]

I'm so happy that my advice helped!!

I know just what you mean and where you're at...

I'm here in the house most of the time, too, and not seeing thesunshine is so hard sometimes. There are times that I enjoyjust being home, there are others that I've GOT to do soemthingdifferent. BUT...the small amount of space definitely doesn'thelp Depression.

Also, you're right...I've noticed that since having the bunnies, I'vehad much less trouble with it...given that I am now forced to docertain things the same time everyday, and clean their cages everyother day, etc. It really helps to have a routine.Not to mention, their love really helps you pull through, doesn'tit? It's that unconditional love...really goes a long way.

I think your plan (and the changes you're making) will really go a longway toward helping you handle this. I should honestly bemaking the same changes (going for walks, etc). It's sohealthy getting out, looking around at the beautiful things around you,enjoying the sunshine on your skin...there's just something about itthat really boosts a person.

I think your plan is perfect, and I really admire all you're doing to help yourself.

My husband and I were talking the other night, and he was telling mehow he hates to see that I basically feel that once my daughter wasborn, I kinda ceased in existance. He tells me I should domore for ME...but it's hard to think that I should, since I really findmyself wrapped up in my daughter, my animals, my husband, and findmyself with no time left for me (and a lack of desire to CREATEtime). This is something I REALLY need to work on.I never get to be just Rosie...I'm always Wifey and Mama (not that Imind, really)...and I know it's damaging and that I need to changeit. I haven't quite figured out how to do that just yet...

Anyway, I'm so happy I helped!! Ya just neverknow how someone will take your advice....and I'm happy that it wassomething that could help you so much.

You're so wonderful, Peg...I can't wait to hear how much those vitamins help.

Love and hugs,

Rosie*

 

[naturestee]

Peg, have you ever talked to your doctor abouttrying a different antidepressant? I started takingantidepressants a few months ago, and my doctor said that herbalremedies don't do a whole lot, otherwise doctors would be prescribingthem. And he had actually researched them just incase. So they might help for mild problems (5-HTP is anotherone), but for more serious problems it would be better to be on aprescription drug.

And because they all work a little differently, some work better forcertain people than others. I'm on my second one after Ideveloped a mild allergy to the first, and not only am I not allergicto it but it seems to be working better. The first one wasZoloft, which my doc says often has good results. The currentone is Celexa, which is very similar but different enough tohelp. Apparently Cymbalta is a newer drug that has shown somevery good results but my health care doesn't cover it.:?

And my hubby recently started taking Wellbutrin for somefibromyalgia-related issues plus it's good for quitting smoking, whichhe is now trying again with better success.

I think the exercise will definately help. It used to be great for me until my depression got even worse...

 

[TinysMom]

Thanks folks - for the pms and the advice onhere too. I'm amazed at the number of "normal" people who havestruggled with this...people whose posts I've read and gone, "Now whycan't I be more laid back like they are??".

I really don't want to go back on the antidepressants if I can help it- mainly because of the sleepiness and some other side effects. Ireally don't want to go running to my doctor right now because I wantto get back on my other meds and take my blood pressure meds and getthat under control a bit - and THEN go talk to him.

I am going to go ahead and get the vitamins Rosie talked about. I have no problem with the idea of taking vitamins...

I went out today and got a haircut and bought some new shoes (Art wasin shock) and even ... <GASP> MAKEUP!Ok so its just foundation, blush and lip gloss...still yet...itssomething.

I really don't feel like I'm at the point where I will take SJW andwhile I still have Paxil here - I don't want to get on it if I can helpit. I did ok on it for over a year but when it startedmessing up - it messed with me really bad and I had suicidal thoughtsand stuff. Once I got off it- I felt SO MUCH better.

Oh well - off to take pictures of bunnies...I have to update my websitethis week. I hate hate hate taking pictures of bunnies - Ithink sometimes that is part of what adds to the depression as theyjust won't cooperate for me.

Peg

 

[maherwoman]

You have no idea how happy I am that I helpedyou...I think you're so wonderful, to hear that I could actually helpYOU for once makes my heart so happy.

Keep me updated on how you're doing, ok? And if you have ANYprobs with the vitamins, let me know...my husband has a LOT ofknowledge and experience with helping people this way (he's who gave methe information on how much and what to take with the B1, and has beenthe one helping me this way through my Depression).

You mentioned that you're going to take some pics of the bunnies...doesthis mean I get even more Daisy pics?? Hehe...

 

[Starina]

I took St. John's Wort when I was younger, andit was amazing. I probably should start taking it again. (Being homeand out of work with a messed up leg isn't the joy it sounds like)

If you want to avoid being frustrated with photos of your bunnies, Ihave some photo tips for you. :cameraMy BF is an artist and Iam the one who ends up taking the photos of his work for his site. Ishoot indoors, I can control more there. Place a white sheet below andbehind the subject, make sure there is space for a lamp behind thebackdrop, the bulb doesn''t really matter. Then light the subject fromthe front, I use an inexpesive adjustable neck lamp with a Reveallightbulb in it. I would see if you can get a helper to move the lightas the bunny moves. If you have a digital camera, just shoot and shootand shoot. When I do "pro" shots I will take 100 photos and only have ahandful of usable shots, this is where having a digital camera ispriceless. If you find yourself getting frustrated, which animals cando, take a break, pet the bunnies. I love this setup because it isvirtually free. Who doesn't have white sheets, and a couple of lamps? Idon't use these techniques for my bunny photos, but now that I amthinking about it, I might. With white bunnies, I would try to use agrey backdrop. Black bunnies, play with the lighting, their fur istroublesome. :tantrum:

I hope that these tips help you out.

~Star~

 

[AngelnSnuffy]

Hey Peg! Many years ago I was put onZoloft. That didn't agree with me at all. It wasweird, it was like I'd feel fine and then when I'd eat something I'dinstantly feel sick. It was awful. My dr switchedme to Paxil and I took that one time and threw the whole presciption inthe garbage. That made me really feel sick-bad. Mydr said if I could get through the first few days, it would graduallygo away. It was so severe I couldn't imagine even taking itone more time. Then I was put on Prozac. Not onlydid I not have any side effects, it worked great. I finallycame to a time when I realized I didn't need it anymore and weanedmyself off it. I'm currently not on it anymore. Ifyou ever get to a time where you may need to go back to something, thismay be the one to try.

I also know someone that got off Paxil a few months ago and was havingterrible side effects for over a month after stopping it. Idon't know how she took it to begin with.

It has been a suggestion to me by others to start taking SJW forperimenopause, but as of yet, I haven't tried it. I haveheard good things about it though.

 

[slavetoabunny]

Hi Peg:

From what you desribe, you may be suffering from "seasonaldepression"(SAD). I lived with someone who had this and Iknow that it is for real:

http://www.clevelandclinic.org/health/health-info/docs/2300/2361.asp?index=9293

Light therapy works extremley well for this. I think that Imay be vulnerable to SAD, but because I use Ott lights(natural daylight bulbs) for my sewing several hours each day, I am"treating" myself. I would be interested to hear aprofessional opinon on this.

 

[ahri22]

Hi Peg,

I have been on and off antidepressants for several years now. I havealways been an overly emotional person...my emotions tend to fluctuatedown, and up...and I also have anxiety issues.

Anyway, a few years ago a good friend of mine went on Paxil...sheimproved a lot...she didn't really even know she was depressed, but hadsocial issues etc (which were a lot like mine). When I heard how muchshe'd improved on the medication, I began to wonder whether going onantidepressants would help me.

The downside to Paxil, as I saw it, was that my friend put on a LOT ofweight. Now, she was one of those very skinny girls who can eatwhatever they like and not put on weight...and she put on about 18kgwithin a few months (about 40lb)...and this is someone who always had asuper fast metabolism, so there was no way that I was going to takesomething that would put on weight (as I'm already depressed enoughabout my size...)

I went on Prozac and found that it helped "level" me, I suppose. Myemotions were more stable, and I had less anxiety. I can't say it mademe 100% better, but I was certainly better able to cope. I felt rathersick for the first couple of weeks, but then started feeling betteragain. I didn't put on any weight with it, which for me was great!

The one downside was that it changed me a bit...I felt less motivatedwith it...kind of hard to explain! So I went off for awhile. Then, Iwent back on...then off, and now I'm on again!! I didn't really want togo back on anti-depressants, but I was finding coping a bithard...especially after losing my heart bunny...which completelycrushed me for the first couple of weeks!!

I know that getting stuff done around the house helps me...I find mydepression's worse when the house looks like a pig sty...but it's amatter of motivating myself enough to get up and do something about it!I do feel better when the house is tidy and everything's in order...

Oh, and before I forget...before I went back on Prozac this time, Itried St. John's Wort...I felt that it worked a little bit, but didn'treally effectively get rid of my depression.

I'm interested in what Rosie said about vitamin supplements, and I may try something like that!!

Cheers
Fiona

 

[CheyAutRanch]

There are MANY different antidepressants outthere. If one you're on has side effects that bother you, you candiscuss with your doctor to try other ones that don't have that.

Just a warning about SJW (for ANYONE who reads this and thinks about trying it)... it makes oral birth control ineffective!

Jessi