Cage sizes...

[BridgetsFlame]

So firstly, I don't own a bun at the moment, however I'm hoping that at the end of next year I'll be able to get one, when I'm finally out of the rental houses etc. So currently I'm reading a lot and working out what sort of budget I'll need for start up. I've owned a lot of pets over the years, but one thing that I guess always irritated me was that I would cut corners, It was never on the things that truly mattered, a ramshackle cage is no different to an animal then a professional cage that matches the furniture. This time though I want to do this the best way and not cut any corners. Right now I'm thinking I'll need $1500 (this includes all accessories, a complete bunny first aid and emergency kit, plus the initial vet costs of a spay/neuter and vaccinations). Plus an additional $500 as the start of an emergency vet fund.

However the one thing I can't find information on anywhere is cage sizes. I honestly don't have that much of an idea on what bread I want. But if someone could give me approximate size requirements for a house bunny that would be locked up for say eight hours at night and six hours during the day, if that. If the bunny was either a Giant (Flemish or British) and English Spot or a mini lop.

I'm thinking a cage 1m x 2m (40" x 80" for those who use imperial) would be suitable? Let me know if I'm wrong! Like I said at the moment I'm in the planning stages, so I can put money away throughout the year so I'm totally prepared when I am eventually in a position to keep pets again...

Oh and I did have one other question, I'll be living with my Mother again and she owns a hand tame cockatiel, I know he is not aggressive whatsoever to mammals, but is very scared of them. However rabbit toys are exactly his favorite type of toys, so how would a rabbit react to a bird stealing their toys? I'm mainly just worried if they'd act aggressively...

Cheers
Emma

 

[elrohwen]

A 1mx2m cage would be a great size for a medium bunny like a lop or maybe even an English spot. I don't think it would be big enough for a Flemmie, however - they should really have free roam of a room, if possible, since they are so huge.

I also think $1500 seems like a lot. I'm in the States, but the exhange rate is close to 1:1 right now - here an exercise pen (1.2mx1.2m) is less than $100 and they make fantastic cages. You can fold them up out of the way (or for travel) and you can customize them with whatever type of flooring you want (I use a cheap area rug for my buns, because they're not carpet chewers, and it looks great in my home). I would say that even with spending $500 on vet care (neuter and first appointment) I spent less than $1000 on my bun and I didn't cut corners or spare any expense. Though your idea of a $500 vet emergency fund is fantastic!

I doubt a bunny would act aggressively to a bird stealing their toys - hopefully the bird wouldn't take it directly from the bunny, but if the bird took it off the floor near the bunny I can't imagine most rabbits noticing or caring. Most rabbits aren't into toys in the same way that dogs and cats are, so they really don't get aggressive or possessive over them. The best toys are usually cardboard boxes that can be dug at and chewed and the bird probably wouldn't even be interested.

I hope this helps!

 

[Korr_and_Sophie]

Where are you planing on keeping the rabbit, inside or outside? A 1mX2m cage could be quite big inside the house. It is a great size if you have room for it.
If you are going that size, I would make a pen not a cage. You can use x-pens (for dogs) and lay them end to end to enclose the space you want. Most x-pens have panels that are 2ft wide and each one usually has 8 panels. If you bought 2 pens, the space would be more than enough for a rabbit that also gets time out of the cage. A pen would only be suitable indoors as it does not provide protection against the elements and predators. 1 pen costs about $80-100 depending on the height and brand. You do need to get one that the rabbit cannot jump over, some rabbits can easily jump a 3ft pen.

Some rabbits are more protective of their toys that others. I would be more concerned about possible diseases that could pass between a bird and a rabbit. I don't really know much about that, but you should do some research. If there could be issues, then I would prevent the bird from getting the toys and wash them often. I think that they could be fine, but it would be a good idea to check it out to be sure.

 

[BridgetsFlame]

I've heard the disease thing before between birds and rabbits, but if either are ill, I have a big problem regardless. Considering the bird is a house bird who lives, eats and sleeps with us, us humans would be more likely to catch something. I do know disease can bass between, but that is what quarantine procedures are for, and if one was diagnosed with an illness that could cross species both would be taken to the vets.

Bunny would be in my bedroom. Honestly they may actually be allowed 24/7 but the rule is we always plan for an animal to need constant supervision when out of their cage, and then change that depending on the animals temperament. It seems to have always worked pretty well/ Echo my Mum's bird started out like that and apart from at night he has free run of the house. He's locked up at night because of his tendency to try and sleep in our beds, he's just to little, we might roll over and squash him...

Also remember everything is that bit more expensive here in Aus, I've been making a list of everything I'll need and it all adds up pretty quickly.

For the cage I'm still debating on what I want, if i go with a pen style cage I'll use enameled ply board as the base, it's what I always used with my guinea pigs and they couldn't even make a mark on it, so even if a rabbit does manage it, it's still safe paint so it should work out well.

I really want something that doesn't look quite so much like a cage to trap animals in, but more of a bunnies sleeping house look. I'm also debating on buying one of those wooden commercial cages similar to this-
http://www.dealsdirect.com.au/p/rabbit-hutch-wooden-1000-450-600/

and modifying the crap out of it to make a little hidey hole sleeping room for a bunny, then a very large pen cage around that....

As to birds and rabbit toys, Echo hates bird toys, all he wants is nice chewy paper etc, so his toys and a rabbit toys would differ only in size.

 

[BridgetsFlame]

I thought I'd share some of my lists I'm making, I'm sure I'm missing a million things, but I'll get there, slowly but surely LOL.

Accessories
Carrier- $30 (www.soldsmart.com.au)
Ceramic Water Bowl- $10 (www.worldforpets.com.au)
Ceramic Pellet Bowl- $10 (www.worldforpets.com.au)
2 x Easily Washable Veggie Bowl- $10 (pink plastic bowl www.worldforpets.com.au)
Hay Box- $20
3 x Litter Trays- $30
Toys- $50 (www.worldforpets.com.au)
Bedding-Oz pet- $10 (www.worldforpets.com.au)
Sleeping Pads- $3


First Aid Kit
Savlon $5 (Woolworth’s)
5cm Gauze $5 (Woolworth’s)
Tweezers (Woolworth’s)
Pumpkin Baby Food $2 (Woolworth’s)
Vegetable Juice $2 (Woolworth’s)
Syringes (2 x 5ml, 4 x 1ml, 3x 3ml) $3 (www.vetnpetcom)
Infacol (online pharmacies, approx $10)
Quit-itch $14 (www.vetnpet.com)
Udderly Smooth Udder Cream (About $10)
Acidophilus Capsules ($30) (Woolworth’s)
Ice Pack $5 (Woolworth’s)
Heating Pad/Bottle $4
Powdered Gatorade $4 (woolworth’s) (Pedilalyte does not exist)
5cm ValuWrap $8.00 (www.vetnpet.com)
Cotton Swabs ($1) (Woolworth’s)
Q-tips $1 (Woolworth’s)
Nail Clippers $8 (www.vetnpet.com
Vaseline (Woolworth’s)
Revolution for Puppies/Kittens $36 (www.vetnpet.com)
Thermometer $20 (www.vetnpet.com)

I know for some people the list would be extremely extensive, but I know from past experience that something will always happen when your way to in the country and have no way to get to a vet, therefore it always helps to have everything on hand.

 

[BridgetsFlame]

If I did go with a pen style cage I was thinking I'd go with two of these...
http://www.crazysales.com.au/42-six...ypen-with-gate-24-8-x-35-4-panels-_p5345.html

However I like the idea of this as well, but would have to do some research on what height Giants need first.
http://www.gtmall.com.au/xxlarge-enclosure-run-for-chick-coop.html

Though it appears that the lid is removable, so I could just sue this as a pen. I guess it's kinda obvious I haven't much idea what i want yet huh? LOL

 

[AquaticRex]

the bigger the cage the better lol. the size sounds fine, and as for the bird stealing rabbit toys, it depends on the bunny in personality. i couldn't see my current rabbit getting aggressive while the one i had when i was a kid would lunge at anything that went near her things. they could get along pretty easy, or not at all. as i said it depends on the personality of both parties.

btw i like the second pet style cage. would bunny be an indoor or outdoor one though?

personally i'd get both and have bunny indoors with the wood one and have the pen for when you want to go outside with bunny.

 

[BridgetsFlame]

Bunny would be entirely indoors, apart from vet trips etc I doubt I'd take it outside at all. I grew up on a property where calici and myxomatosis went through the wild population every year, I would be way to paranoid to let a bunny outside even when I'm living in town.

Lunging could probably be okay, the main problem would be if a bunny grabbed the birds tail, I had this one guinea pig obsessed with doing that and of course Echo would lash back. Normally it's harmless but Echo could do serious damage if he struck an eye, just as a rabbit could do damage if it managed to pull out or break any of Echos blood feathers. But if its only based on personality it should be okay, it would just mean increasing the ground rules for both animals.

 

[AquaticRex]

ok yea deffinatly indoors then lol

and yea its a personality thing. thats another reason to prolly go with the wood framed one. it would be somewhere for the rabbit to retreat to when it wants to be on it's own away from everything, while with the other pen, the bird could get in no problem. as well you wouldn't have as big of an issue with the toys going missing while still having other toys in the free range areas for both to play with.

 

[BridgetsFlame]

Hmm I wish I could actually build things LOL, But I'm not that good, However I have the most amazing plans in my head for an awesome cage. Will see if I can draw it up....

 

[AquaticRex]

yea draw it up. actually i think if you bring the drawing and dimensions to a place that sells and can cut wood, they'll make sure everything is cut to size and all you'd have to do is nail it all together and staple gun chicken wire or something to it. I'd say Home Depot but i dunno if you guys have that in Australia...

 

[BridgetsFlame]

We have Bunnings, but they aint gonna cut that much wood, nor do they cut it straight, so then you have useless wood. There's more factors as well, my father has a thing about girls using tools, the last time I decided to build a cage he absolutely freaked, that was a fun time, not LOL. But if I could, space allowing I'd love this, though lord knows how I'd get something this size indoors

It's quite rough, but a nice big cage, with a second level, and a large step up to that level, and a nice big door.

 

[Flash Gordon]

wow u really plan ahead dont you.......
i have a bun that charges at my cats ..most of the time if a bun charges at something they head butt it first...my cats have been traumatized over this..hehe,..they run for their lives when Petunia is out..she does a perimiter check every 10 min or so...keeping an eye out for the enemy...and if one of my cats happens to be in the area..she is like a locomotive running at them..but she hesitates for a second when she gets to them..then BONK!..my cats dont know what to do..hehe..i shouldnt laugh but it is quite a site..is ur birds wings clipped?i dont think a bun would attack a bird i mean rabbits are at the bottom of the food chain..they dont harm anything but each other...ive never heard of a bunny attacking another critter.but maybe somebody else on here will be along that has.....ive been headbutted by a bunny before and they really slam into u hard...i have no idea why Doodle did this to me ..except he did it when i got down on all fours and was coming towards him....im not gonna lie i got the heck outta his xpen real quick...anyways ill be back on later to reread ur list ..im still shocked at ur thoroughness...not many people do this much ahead of time for a new critter in the family...i think its kewl..
im still trying to figure out ur cage idea..is there gonna be a top on it?.its kinda looking like a guinea pig cage layout..

 

[AquaticRex]

hmm, do you know anyone around you who has the power tools to do the cutting right? just buy the wood you need and have the people at the Bunnings store cut about 4 or 5 inches bigger then you need. then ask the person you know to help you out with making the ends straight. after that bring the wood pieces home and ask your dad to help you finish the assembling. say it'll be a father daughter project to spend time together, that usually got my dad when i was a kid (plus it is true, you would be spending time together) lol. my dad has the same outlook. he stopped freaking out when he came home and found my house project in my room almost done and pretty much all correct lol. i don't encourage going behind your dads back like i did though. i got into trouble and had a lot of people on my side, including my mom, who he practically bows to (though he'll never admit to it) lol. now he just looks at me disapprovingly when i pick up a hammer lol

 

[BridgetsFlame]

There's a fairly simple reason why I'm planning ahead, my pets went to their new homes yesterday and it's killing me to think I can't have pets anymore, so there for I start researching. As to thoroughness, past experience has taught me it's best. I've been badly caught out before (you never want to have to evacuate within five minutes because of an oncoming bush fire and realize you have thirty guinea pigs to move and no carry cages or have a surprise litter that needs to be hand reared with nothing but cows milk on hand, suffice it to say neither situation worked out well, and actually were rather directly linked)

It is similar to a guinea pig cage layout, just huge, and yes it would have a wire top. The thick black lines are the wooden beams, the base of the cage, the second step level and the top level are plywood, the rest would be wire. The gray area on the top level is empty space, so they can access it. For those who aren't familiar with metric the base cage is eight feet by four feet, the second level is eight feet by two feet.

Considering I won't be getting a rabbit till I move, all I'll know are uni students. As to getting my father's help I'll be seven hours away... However I don't think my mother would approve of me buying power tools anymore then my father did. I tried the father daughter project thing a few years ago, it ended up with me paying an absolute fortune for a professional builder to make the cages I needed and my father not talking to me for a year. He still insists cages don't need ventilation.

Basically I just want something large, that looks nice, I'm big on aesthetics, though will often relinquish them for some nice very bright color coordinated cage. I've used C&C before, but I'm not really a fan, plus they cost an absolute bomb here in the land of Oz. Most commercial cages are also way way too small.

 

[Flash Gordon]

im a tool kinda girl..i work on cars for a living...actually i do graphics on them and racing stripes ..that kinda stuff..but i love tools..got lots of em..we all would have a build fest if we lived closer...my dad didnt like me touching tools either ..girls arent suppose to be in the garage...i proved him wrong..i have my own business working on cars and i have a muscle car in the garage...all mine..hehe..
anyways i have been stockpiling up on wood hutch parts cuz im tired of the cage look that i have with all my buns..you walk in my house and it looks like a rescue..i decided i want to do the wood hutches cuz they look more like furniture..and we are stacking 2 of them so it takes up less space....they all get out for hours during the day so im not too concerned (like i was)with having a large cage for them..i ran out of room in my house ..first the kitchen table went...then the coffee table....then i got a smaller entertainment center ......im slowly getting pushed out of the house..i dont care buns give me way more then a coffee table does....ok rambling..
so how many bunnies are u thinking about housing in ur bunny tazmahal?...
are u gonna be able to get in this thing to clean the very back of it.?.ihad to shrink one of my cages cuz of this.....see this is why you are goin over this all ahead of time...smart.

 

[BridgetsFlame]

I only want one bunny, I'm thinking I'd like a British Giant, just gotta find a breeder, which is always a fun challenge.

I come from a very large very traditional family. All of the guys in the family apart from my brother have engineering degrees. Until I came along no female 'of the bloodline' (sarcastic quotes there) had ever been to university. Not only did I point blank refuse to follow in my fathers footsteps and become an engineer I chose a law degree. According to my family lawyers are the scum of the earth... I should take a nice arts degree and become a teacher, yeah right.

I want to have an amazing set up, so pre-planning is always good, I still have no real idea of what i want though LOL.

 

[AquaticRex]

Flash Gordon:
i like your style lol. weird thing though, my dad always said girls weren't meant to build stuff, but taught me to work on cars, insisting it's for when i break down on a highway so i dont have to pay a fortune to have someone else fix it, that anything that can be bought (such as cages) should be bought and not built by women. i have 2 cars, one monty 84 and one camaro 87 sitting under tarps at my parents house half done. moving 8 hours away made it a little hard to bring them up when they're not working >.<

BridgetsFlame:
warning you now, it's not gonna be just one bunny lol. you'll get hooked and find that you want another one lol. i got Dante thinking "just one is good" and now i want to see if i can find my neutered boy a spayed girlfriend lol. i made a deal in advance with my boyfriend that if i found a job (i lost mine a few months after i got Dante due to the place being stupid and shutting down.. would you believe they just left a note on the employee entrance saying "sorry to inform you but we are not longer in need of anyone's services" and just took off, not even my last pay was given to me!! ok i'm stopping now cause i'm just gonna get worked up --.--) anyways the deal was if i found another job i could get a second bunny. i don't think he expected me to find one so quick lol, but i did, i start Friday ^_^
so yea, i will promise you that the thought of a second bunny will at the very least cross your mind lol either 1 cause you think they're so adorable and addicting, or 2 you'll look at the first one and be like "awww!! maybe i should get him a bunny friend" (btw bonding is hard... i found out the hard way lol)

so yea back to the issue at hand...

how much space do you have to work with? i've got a whole room to work with so i can expand almost as much as i want, but some people dont have the space due to furniture and so on. especially with the larger breeds, bigger is better for sure. if you find that you dont have enough room for your bunny, you could always build up if you cant expand out lol

you said you only know university ppl, but what if you tracked down a collage person that is in wood working?? that might help lol. you would get the wood, they could prolly build it for you, and cause they're a student you could prolly end up getting the cage you wanted for half the price and the student could get graded on the cage. of course no one is going to just do it for free, but most of the time, cause they're not exactly pro's at it, you wont get charged hard for their work.. just a thought.

 

[BridgetsFlame]

Definitely only one bunny, I've done the OMG I need more thing and never ever again. One spoilt rotten bun and no more.

No idea how much space I have to work with, I should probably explain the situation more fully, Basically my parents are involved in a very messy divorce. When they do finally get everything finalized my mother will purchasing a house in town somewhere, rather then being forced back to college, I'll be living with her. At the moment I'm shuttling between both parents and college, it's fun really, not LOL.

As to university people, I think we have our wires crossed on what a uni is... I don't know any uni that offers building courses, nor one that would allow someone to use a cage as course work, actually or a uni that lets someone keep what they made for coursework... The university I'm at is solely history, medicine, law and agriculture, so if I wanted a horse stable I'd be good, but otherwise everything's pretty esoteric...

 

[AquaticRex]

nothing wrong with building a horse stable for your bunny. wouldnt have to worry about size thats for sure lmao jk. yea i guess you guys do it different there then lol. the collage i did attend would let you choose your project and let you keep it after it was done, unless it was one of the best pieces of work they've seen that year, then they would ask to keep it for the collage displays.

and i'm sorry to hear about the divorce. it has got to be wearing on you as well as them, especially with being yanked around a bit by all parties involved.